alpalwal

Here's a couple links to the Lancia s4 which was a company that worked with twincharging
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...54982393200624

http://forum.mazda6tech.com/about3547.html
Here the supercharger is before the turbo... What about vice versa with the turbo first?
I've even heard just pump them both separately into the I/m. Sounds the easiest actaully because you don't need all the one way valves.

I thought the concept was to be able to use a big turbo without the lag of just a turbo setup.. but i've seen a couple with small turbos.


I'm building up a ka24 240 and I think it'd be a fun project.

Use a supercharger off a mercedes -one with a electric clutch-
turbo -not sure big or small-, big - holset *35* or small -t25?
water injection?

I read it's a bitch to tune, but I don't really see why, set your boost level and the sc/t crossover rpm and tune?

I'm looking for 450+ hp, but if I can avoid 450hp worth of lag, why not?

kill-ka-t-kill

superchargers only work on top end, they take more energy to run than turbos. a decent sized turbo would support more airflow than a supercharger. the only way to eliminate the lag would not be to run twin turbos but run a smaller turbo in sequence with a larger one ( run the inlet of the turbine housing off the outlet of the larger turbo) this would create an additional problem, there would be extra lag on top end from the smaller turbine housing. you could solve this by putting a wastegate between the two that would regulate the boost of the smaller turbo and realese extra exhaust gas pressure once it reaches its set level of boost. its just too much bs, i vote for single turbo if you want to make some good numbers on a smaller engine.

alpalwal

I'm talking about using a roots blower, which are known to be good bottom end, and poor top end. and i'm not doing sequential turbo... jgy customs is already doing that and it looks like it sucks to do. Might work in the end, but even more complicated than twin charging

krustindumm

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Lane/1231/page2.html

http://img477.imageshack.us/my.php?i...ncharge5zy.jpg
my idea, drawn in 5 minutes with paintbrush, and little to no thinking. Maybe put the charger on the other side of the engine. Either way, uses simpler pipe routing and a MAFS. Plus with the charger before the TB you can get the BOV to vent for a few minutes at a time. Oh, and it would use any standard intercooler plumbing, i think.

-Dustin

[edit: makes sense to me...do i need to label it?]

kill-ka-t-kill

use one turbo you will like it more that way. the ka has plenty of bottom end and if its a little laggy ---- it you will enjoy all the top end a lot more without having to drag that sc around . i wouldnt argue about it, you will just have to learn the hard way.

Freebs

Yep roots blowers have HUGE bottom end... thats what i am using in this set up... and the blower is litterly just bolted right to the head... i see boost right instantly with it... and with a T3/To4E 46 trim turbo on a car like mine... people arent even getting full boost till around 3000rpm... and the turbo i have is a T3/T04E 6o trim... so just think of how much lag would be there with out the supercharger but also how HUGE!!!! the top end is going to be

kill-ka-t-kill

and every time you shift your rpms fall below 3k right? trying to launch at 1500 would only slow you down and also adding a turbo would create lag regardless. you would be creating too much drag on your engine adding all this crap and it would be much slower than it would be with just a turbo. also once you finally build boost from the turbo it would only be capable of flowing as much air as the supercharger by itself.

Freebs

**Shakes head** man where do you people come up with your stuff? have you personaly looked into it? or are you just going on things you have heard?

1. i dont rev my engine up when i launch...

2. drag on the engine? how so? it would be no different then if it was just the supercharger... the turbo isnt putting any more load on it

3.you obviously dont know your stuff or else you would know that because the turbo is compressing the air before it goes threw the supercharger it will already be compressed, technically letting more air into it... say _____ thats how much the s/c'er can take normaly.. the turbo turns "_____" in to __... still the same amount of air but its been compressed already... not 100% acurate but thats about as simple as i can make it

4. Yes when it fianlly spools i will have power... hence the supercharger for the lag in power... the Roots blowers have such nice low end power they will destroy most turboed cars with in the same class as me off the line but their top end BLOWS and turbo cars will always come out the winner in that one... there for you combind both and you have good low and and you can get a bigger turbo for even BIGGER top end then a normal car would have since they couldnt even spool the turbo you use or wouldnt spool till like 5000rpm....

I said it before but a 2.4L like mine will fully spool a Garrett T3/T04E 46 trim turbo at 3000rpm.... I have a T3/T04E 60 trim... i bet you i will fully spool sooner then a regular turbo 2.4L with a bigger turbo being that the supercharger will be forcing air threw the turbo from the second i hit the gas and will also be sucking it threw the turbo, resulting in a FAST spool up...

And NO i am not saying my end power will be higher then a Turbo 2.4L... i am saying i will have MUCH more lower end power and a way steeper power curve..

Now my question for you is...
Do you understand compression ratios?

reddevil

I am already supercharged via an Eaton M62. Am running a 2-1 pulley ratio for about 9 psi on an old Subaru 2.2 NA motor.

Am planning on adding a 2nd supercharger (have a different motor build up in progress) and will probably just dump both charges into a front mount. Technically, I will be attempting to shove 3 liters of air per revolution into the motor.

I wonder what would happen if you did supercharger into supercharger?

robus

it's been done but I think you would have big problems in the intake air temperature... much too hot
you'll be better off feeding a turbo, imo
at high rpms the supercharger should be switched off via the bypass valve
at low and mid rpms you'd have the sc-turbo combo and at high rpm only the turbo:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Lane/1231/twinlo.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Lane/1231/twinhi.jpg