Turbo Banshee is alive!
06-17-2007, 06:47 PM
#21
1.0 BAR
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 277
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
yeah, really informative. my dad owns a motorcycle shop, and we get quite a few two strokes in there. re-ringing a bike is alot less complicated than converting to efi and fabricating a turbocharger system. major props to your work, sounds like you really have it covered.
as i sit here thinking about this, i remember reading this one article about a 2stroke efi engine in Europe that is compliant with smog standards because the system it uses for fuel injects the fuel after the piston passes the exhaust port, so no loss of fuel, ect. problem is to get fuel to atomize in the combustion chamber the pressure in the injection system have to be tremendous to overcome the pressure of the compression in the cylinder.
so my next question is, how hard would it be to integrate a high pressure direct injection system using a custom drilled head/ect
that system is used to get good gas mileage and low emissions but i wonder how it would do performance wise.
as i sit here thinking about this, i remember reading this one article about a 2stroke efi engine in Europe that is compliant with smog standards because the system it uses for fuel injects the fuel after the piston passes the exhaust port, so no loss of fuel, ect. problem is to get fuel to atomize in the combustion chamber the pressure in the injection system have to be tremendous to overcome the pressure of the compression in the cylinder.
so my next question is, how hard would it be to integrate a high pressure direct injection system using a custom drilled head/ect
that system is used to get good gas mileage and low emissions but i wonder how it would do performance wise.
06-17-2007, 09:33 PM
#22
0.5 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 79
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
AHhhhhh.... direct injection... I wish bombardier went a bit futher with this but everyone hates 2-strokes. See they tryied to carry it out on the sleds they were selling to yellowstone park. (for the green standards ----) But it was much sheaper and easier to go to 4 strokes. since they already had tons of production motors out there on the shelf.
But.... to answer your Q I have a real simple answer.... diesel injectors. All diesels are direct inject engines so making one work on your 2 stroke would be very easy if you have the right tools.(mill) Just hit up the junk yard and find an old saab or volvo.... or even a VW TDI which is where my turbo came from. I'm sure you could come up with something if you gave it a look.
As for permormance... well I would assume at least 10% right off the bat and another 25% better fuel milage. I'm no einstein when it comes to diesel injectors so the only thing I know is that they are controlled by a gear drive off the crank. It might be a little hard to tune. Maybe one of the newer cars has EDI...? That would make evrything a whole lot simpler to adapt to other rides.
I think I'll start google'in ---- and I'll check back with more....it's a slow night again here at work anyways.
Kudo's 2 U REXSK8ER!!!! great idea!
But.... to answer your Q I have a real simple answer.... diesel injectors. All diesels are direct inject engines so making one work on your 2 stroke would be very easy if you have the right tools.(mill) Just hit up the junk yard and find an old saab or volvo.... or even a VW TDI which is where my turbo came from. I'm sure you could come up with something if you gave it a look.
As for permormance... well I would assume at least 10% right off the bat and another 25% better fuel milage. I'm no einstein when it comes to diesel injectors so the only thing I know is that they are controlled by a gear drive off the crank. It might be a little hard to tune. Maybe one of the newer cars has EDI...? That would make evrything a whole lot simpler to adapt to other rides.
I think I'll start google'in ---- and I'll check back with more....it's a slow night again here at work anyways.
Kudo's 2 U REXSK8ER!!!! great idea!
06-18-2007, 12:28 PM
#23
1.0 BAR
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 277
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
yeah, most diesels have mechanical direct injection. they work off a gear driven injection pump, which has a cam in it and as the cam rotates it presses plungers on the corresponding cylinders. this would be way to complicated for your setup, as you'd have to do away with the whole megasquirt system.
if i recall correctly, the VW 2.5l v6 diesel engine with 180 hp and the 3.3 v8 both have the "common rail" fuel system that youd have to find in order to rob the parts for your system. actually its on this website
http://tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-1.html#d
"Finally, some modern diesel engines use a "common rail" injection system. The concept is much like a conventional gasoline engine EFI system but the pressure involved is on the order of 1000 times higher. A single central high-pressure pump delivers fuel to a pressurized fuel line, and separate solenoid valves on each cylinder admit fuel into each injector. Although this sounds simple, it is extremely difficult to make it work due to the extremely high pressures involved. This system is used on the 180hp version of the 2.5 litre V6, and on the 3.3 litre V8."
since diesels usually run upwards of 800 bar ~11,000 psi fuel pressure i think this would be plenty. for what your doing. im not sure on the flow rates or anything, but if you could possibly find injectors in the aftermarket that fit your needs, it could work
also, you could possibly use the injectors off of a FSI vw engine, or any other gasoline direct injection system, with a modified fuel rail system possibly baised on one of the engines mentioned above.
if i recall correctly, the VW 2.5l v6 diesel engine with 180 hp and the 3.3 v8 both have the "common rail" fuel system that youd have to find in order to rob the parts for your system. actually its on this website
http://tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-1.html#d
"Finally, some modern diesel engines use a "common rail" injection system. The concept is much like a conventional gasoline engine EFI system but the pressure involved is on the order of 1000 times higher. A single central high-pressure pump delivers fuel to a pressurized fuel line, and separate solenoid valves on each cylinder admit fuel into each injector. Although this sounds simple, it is extremely difficult to make it work due to the extremely high pressures involved. This system is used on the 180hp version of the 2.5 litre V6, and on the 3.3 litre V8."
since diesels usually run upwards of 800 bar ~11,000 psi fuel pressure i think this would be plenty. for what your doing. im not sure on the flow rates or anything, but if you could possibly find injectors in the aftermarket that fit your needs, it could work
also, you could possibly use the injectors off of a FSI vw engine, or any other gasoline direct injection system, with a modified fuel rail system possibly baised on one of the engines mentioned above.
06-21-2007, 07:34 PM
#24
0.5 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 79
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
Here is a quick run down of the oil pump as we went along.... as promised! Before you guys ask I'll say that I have a temp. coupling between the shaft and clutch to drive the unit. The permenent peice is still just a program in the cnc for now. I wanted to make sure it worked ok before spending too much time making ---- on the machine.
And some pics of the finished electronics box. I just ended up using the lid of the box I was originally gunna use. I had thought I was going to be putting a battery in there at first. But I needed some more juice for the monster lights I'll be putting on soon......I'm a nocturnal rider!
ALL THAT JUST FOR THE BOOST GAUGE ON THE LEFT HAND!!!!! In your honor HMT knights!!!
More pics this weekend I promise! Finally some timme off before the big 4th shutdown. Maybe I can get my little bro to take some more vids of it actually moving on the street...
L8r guys ~ Bansheeboy420
And some pics of the finished electronics box. I just ended up using the lid of the box I was originally gunna use. I had thought I was going to be putting a battery in there at first. But I needed some more juice for the monster lights I'll be putting on soon......I'm a nocturnal rider!
ALL THAT JUST FOR THE BOOST GAUGE ON THE LEFT HAND!!!!! In your honor HMT knights!!!
More pics this weekend I promise! Finally some timme off before the big 4th shutdown. Maybe I can get my little bro to take some more vids of it actually moving on the street...
L8r guys ~ Bansheeboy420
06-21-2007, 07:39 PM
#25
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 0
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
Originally Posted by TurboBanshee420
AHhhhhh.... direct injection... I wish bombardier went a bit futher with this but everyone hates 2-strokes. See they tryied to carry it out on the sleds they were selling to yellowstone park. (for the green standards ----) But it was much sheaper and easier to go to 4 strokes. since they already had tons of production motors out there on the shelf.
But.... to answer your Q I have a real simple answer.... diesel injectors. All diesels are direct inject engines so making one work on your 2 stroke would be very easy if you have the right tools.(mill) Just hit up the junk yard and find an old saab or volvo.... or even a VW TDI which is where my turbo came from. I'm sure you could come up with something if you gave it a look.
As for permormance... well I would assume at least 10% right off the bat and another 25% better fuel milage. I'm no einstein when it comes to diesel injectors so the only thing I know is that they are controlled by a gear drive off the crank. It might be a little hard to tune. Maybe one of the newer cars has EDI...? That would make evrything a whole lot simpler to adapt to other rides.
I think I'll start google'in ---- and I'll check back with more....it's a slow night again here at work anyways.
Kudo's 2 U REXSK8ER!!!! great idea!
But.... to answer your Q I have a real simple answer.... diesel injectors. All diesels are direct inject engines so making one work on your 2 stroke would be very easy if you have the right tools.(mill) Just hit up the junk yard and find an old saab or volvo.... or even a VW TDI which is where my turbo came from. I'm sure you could come up with something if you gave it a look.
As for permormance... well I would assume at least 10% right off the bat and another 25% better fuel milage. I'm no einstein when it comes to diesel injectors so the only thing I know is that they are controlled by a gear drive off the crank. It might be a little hard to tune. Maybe one of the newer cars has EDI...? That would make evrything a whole lot simpler to adapt to other rides.
I think I'll start google'in ---- and I'll check back with more....it's a slow night again here at work anyways.
Kudo's 2 U REXSK8ER!!!! great idea!
smokin hot
07-23-2007, 03:12 AM
#27
0.5 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 79
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
I haven't forgotten about the HMT.... just making things progress
Had a bit of a problem this weekend when I smoked the ignition driver (VB921) on the circiut board of the megasquirt. Had the dwell set too long and made too much heat...rookie mistake. I'll be running again by wedsday when the new parts get here. Besides... how else do you learn if you don't get to take the same thing apart 50 times.
Had a bit of a problem this weekend when I smoked the ignition driver (VB921) on the circiut board of the megasquirt. Had the dwell set too long and made too much heat...rookie mistake. I'll be running again by wedsday when the new parts get here. Besides... how else do you learn if you don't get to take the same thing apart 50 times.
07-23-2007, 11:32 AM
#30
1.5 BAR
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 840
Re: Turbo Banshee is alive!
Originally Posted by TurboBanshee420
Had a bit of a problem this weekend when I smoked the ignition driver (VB921) on the circiut board of the megasquirt. Had the dwell set too long and made too much heat...rookie mistake. I'll be running again by wedsday when the new parts get here. Besides... how else do you learn if you don't get to take the same thing apart 50 times.
