Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Im building my own traction bars this week but Im lost on one thing. The bars are going on an EF with 300ish WHP

I dont understand the difference or cause or effects or upsides of running 4 HEIM joints on my radius rods.

Im trying to save pennies everywhere but dont mind spending the coin if I will notice a differece.

Its either run 4 heim joints, or 2 at the front and a solid mount at the lower control arm with a 2 bolt bracke threer like the stock radious rods connect.

I noticed BEAU ran a solid mount on his race car

Thanks

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Is this a street car/daily driver or a full fledged street car? Beau's car doesn't need to turn that much besides to turn around after driving 1/4 mile. If it's a street car I'd go with heims at each end.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

I'm going to thread jack because my question is related.


When you tighten your trailing arms (whomever) do you tighten then to draw in or push out and HOW tight? I think mine right now are pushed out, but I'm not sure which way is right or acutally HOW tight they should be, haha.


JP

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Stock uses solid mounts, and stock cars turn around between each 1/4 mile run.

Jimfab, and several others, use solid mounts and work well.

Beau's car has suspension issues keeping him from running a whole second faster; you need a more indepth examination of his car to pick out what is done right and what is done wrong, inclusive of video, and a real life teardown and inspection to see what is getting wear transferred to it and how.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

To use them for most effect draw the control arms forward. You pull the control arms in because pushing them back would give you less caster which will create a handling concern. That caster is what keeps the wheels straight when you drive forward.

HOWEVER, you must adjust the tie rods because pulling the control arms in will give you major toe out. This will make your vehicle vibrate really bad since both wheels will be turned outward a little bit. So adjust the tie rods to give you stock toe.

Now you have a good amount of preload on the bushings and a good safe alignment. How much preload you want on the bushings is up to you. More will decrease bsuhing life, but will keep the wheel from moving back and forth so much. I turn the rod about two turns or so on each side for a good amount of preload.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

On a street car, would a solid mount be fine with a 2 bolt connection at the LCA? Adjustability would still be there as the insert would be threaded. Im personally curious if ride quality would change, and some absurd noises would arise from the solid mount. ive never run in, seen or driven anything other than stock

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

If stock rubber doesn't creak heims won't.

The LCA is held immobilised with 2 or 4 heim setups, but the 4 heim setup has 4 heims that undergo just as much force apiece as two heim setups do, only difference is they have 4 heims to go bad and replace.

Can you see my preferrence?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

good stuff..

when you say towards to car do you mean towareds the bumper? or towards the back of your fender?

another concern i have is that the 3 bolts holes for the tow hooks on my 4 door are all stripped. can i design one that just uses the original points on the crossmember and not use the ones on the tow hooks? i assume the points on the tow hooks plus the ones on the cross member make it that much more surdy but will it be fine if i desing one without those? what other options if any do i have?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Sounds like a 2 heim setup is what Im going to be going for.

5/8" is plenty right?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Yes pull them towards the bumper.


I am not really familiar with the EF chassis. Are the tow hooks mounted like the EG/DC/EKs?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Ive seen all 3 types of bars created

Most common is the 3 tow hooks alone, I think Josh @ JK_Motorsports changed to using both the tow hook holes and the underneath plate

And Ive seen a few just utilizing the stock crossmember bolt holes.

Search UP ETD racing on ebay or there site and thats the kinda bar they make (stock member location only)

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

How exactly is a Jimfab style bar adjusted anyways?

Looking at pictures, they seem to be one solid piece of bar, milled and drilled for the LCA at one end, then tapped for the heim at the front.

If the bar is installed and locked down to the LCA how do you turn the bar up and or down the threads to make adjustments?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

No, EF are exactly the same as DA with regards to LCAs and crossmembers, and ED are very similar. The radius rods and crossmember assembly has nothing to do with the tow hooks.

Pop the heim free from the crossmember, loosen the lock nut, twist as needed, tighten lock nut and bolt back to the crossmember. Pretty simple.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Wouldnt that make it so the bar could no longer be installed though since the bolt wouldnt fit back thru?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

ED chassis LCAs dance around without the radius rods connected, bro, even after you've upgraded to poly bushes. If you tried to drive without them installed a stock Si WOT power output should be enough to rip the LCA free from it's inboard mounting point.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

??? I meant, if you unbolt the heim from the crossbar, turn it a few clockwise turns into the bar, then try and reinstall it, wont the bolt holes of the HEIM and the crossbar mount now no longer line up, thus causing you not to be able to slide the bolt back through?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

You mean the LCA, which dances around and takes at most 20 lbs force to deflect two inches, is going to keep the radius rod from reaching the crossmember?

:P

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Did JK Motorsports ever fix the 'issue' of the breaking pieces that was a big topic a while back? The only reason I ask is because I was looking to get traction bars also, but Im starting to lean towards a set i saw on ebay by ETD (I think thats what they were called, they were canadian too) if JK hasnt fixed/upgraded the design.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Search some EDT bars on Honda-Tech, alot of people had some pretty big problems with them, bending and the hardware snapping, some very ungodly damage to a few cars.

Id look elsewhere

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

If i remember correct;ly, jk fixed the issue with the new bars and he and lsd offered to fix the old ones for free with the new mounting design

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

remember this too...

if on one end you have a left thread heim and a right thread on the other, you can set preloads on them without taking the bolts that hold the bar in. Just loosen the jam nuts and twist.

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Ive started fabbing this bar in my spare time, got me heim joints on order and they will be here anyday

One thing Ive come to a stop on is my radius rod bars. I went with a solid mount at the LCA, and instead of making something to bolt to the LCA, I simply cut off the end of the stock radius rods, stuck them into my 5/8" ID bar and welded it on.

Now with both bolts in the LCA, it holds my radius rods (at the front of the car) about 3 1/2" above my new crossbar since I went quite low with it, maybe 2" lower than stock.

I was hoping to simply heat up and bend the stock portion of the radius rod I cut off, bend them to the correct angle to meet up with the crossbar.

Was curious if that would cause any problems?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

I was planning on using 4 heims. The two on the (crx) lca's were going to be turned flat instead of vertical and run a bolt through the heim into the original bolt hole where the stock radius arm was bolted. Make sense?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

Ive already started this design, there already welded, im just waiting on heims\

Can I bend the bar downwards or not?

Re: Traction Bar Design - 4 Heims VS 2 Heims and SOLID LCA Mount
 

bump