honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

ive loved both imports and domestics for a long time. i also wander why the hell am i fixing up a 2L instead of something that has an xtra 6 cylinders on it. imports are fun because of the sheer fun of anihilating stock mustangs and camaros. but what if they put 600$ into it then wed have no chance. just wandering what makes you pick import over domestic muscle aside from gas consumption.

and for the honda with 5k in it vs a stock new mustang for alot more, how about a 92 lx 5.0 for around the same price with 5k in it.

please dont flame eachother, i just wanna know what makes you chose import vs domestic.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

---- imports, I chose domestic power anyday. With the rising evolution in fuel injection technology I should be able to get fairly good gas millage on a v8 setup.

Weight of the vehicle is a big factor.

You can't even compare a honda to a porsche, the shear engineering of the german sports car dominates a little compact economy rice burner.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

well lets see here. you asked about a $5K civic running with a stock mustang. some people on here are running 13 sec civics for under 5K dollars. how fast does a stock rustang run...about 15sec. so that would be one anwser...

Let me ask you, why do you hop up a V-8? for the same reasons I like to hop up my 4cyl.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

But boy is it sure funny when I blew by my boss in my crvtec turbo crx while he was driving his 03 911 Twin turbo ::) Not to mention the guys faces in the brand new viper I ate on the freeway..

Apples and oranges, different tastes for different people.

I personally work on both import/domestic everyday. I simply cannot stand working on domestic cars & trucks. The way things are engineered, put together and so cheaply made nowadays it makes me sick. I love japanese engineering, styling and quality.

For 5 grand you could be pretty close to making a 11sec crx/civic. However I'm sure with 5 grand in a mustang or camaro it would be way easier to hit 11's if not 10's.
(not incl car)

Jeff

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

okay, so Jeff has a fast car.. but can your rex handle like a porsche?? Does it stop like a porsche?

That's the engineering point I would like to make. You can make any car in the world a fast car, but your limitations are within the design of it.

The only car I enjoy working on is my volvos.. the rest piss me off.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I think Jeff hit it on the head pretty straight and to the point.

It is all a matter of opinion.


I have owned a 74 nove (the last year for the fast back style) I absoutly loved it to death.

Now I own a 94 honda civic, and also love it to death.

If I absoutly choose one or the other, it would be very very difficult.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

domestics are fun. but they dont have that tight feel that imports have. i dont know its just personal prefrence but. id take a turbo import 4 banger over a v8 anyday.
i wouldent care if you could make a street mustang run 7's for the same amount as it took a crx to get mid 12's. its just not as fun to drive for me.

plus everyone of my freinds who has a firebird or a camaro or a mustang. when they drive my car. they always say somthing like. this feels realy tight. this makes my car feel like a peice of ----. i never thought a 4 banger could light up the tires like that.

my firebird is fun and all. and it would kick just about any 5.0 rustangs ass unless there FI. i took it to the track with slicks i ran an 11.39. but id still rather drive my celica around.

v8's are cool but i guess i just like a challenge

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

No I dont have 18in brakes, carbon fiber drivershafts, adjustable suspension or wings that go automatically up at 75mph. I have a 6000 dollar crx with a full road race cage in it that handles like its on rails and when I am done with it I will be able to do circles around porsches. Not to mention to spare about 130 grand :P

Don't get me wrong porsches are nice cars, but again they fall in the class of "shitty cars to work on" just like domestics. I hate working on European cars, parts are way over priced, to many special tools to own to work on them.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

^ Hit it on the head. For the price of a single new porsche, you could have quite a few bad-ass imports, that could handle and feel just as good as a Porsche.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

Crx $2000
built motor and turbo kit $2000
misc ----= 700

Total =$4700

Best time to date is 13.86 @100 w/10psi. Sure to be in the 12's with 15psi.

Braking and cornering aren't in my vocabulary. I'm here to go fast, not skid to a stop. 8)

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

but could it get you laid as much as a porsche? i think not.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

Since when did trying to make your Honda fast have anything to do with getting laid? ::)
Also, if you're buying a Porsche just so you can get laid, you're ------- pathetic. Some kids at school said they'd rather own a $600,000+ Ferrari then the $125,000 1200 HP/TQ Chevy Chicayne (See HotRod.com) merely because of social status. I don't understand that.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

thats the whole point of owning a porche. to drive it and have someone look at you and say. WHOA HES IN A PORSCHE!!
or to have some bitch think WHOA HES GOT TO BE LOADED!

thats the german engeniering right thur to get the weibchens.

id rather have my celica all done out to how i like it than a porsche. i dont realy care what i drive as long as it handles awesomely and is fast.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

http://images.getauto.com/vehicles/W...1S686216-4.jpg

http://images.getauto.com/vehicles/W...1S686216-2.jpg

http://images.getauto.com/vehicles/W...1S686216-6.jpg

My bosses Porsche

https://www.homemadeturbo.com/turbo/tt/tt40.jpg

https://www.homemadeturbo.com/jeff/cage1.jpg

https://www.homemadeturbo.com/drag/oct19/rr.jpg

and my crx.. (which I just passed a porsche on a corner)

It's pretty obvious the porsche is going to get you laid way before the crx But hey.. I love it :-*

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

getting laid cause you drive a porsche is only part of the reason for owning one.. you own them cause the way they drive. My best friend's dad (who is in his 60s now) used to race nascar back in the day. All while growing up he had porsches, I think he owned a total of 17 of them or something crazy. He was married, had no urges to go out and get laid (I'm sure he was wild way back in the day tho) but he drove porsches cause they way they handled. Now he drives a kia since he lost his ass on a business he was running and is had a big fall.

I would love to own a porsche 911/993 clone eventually.. first step is finding a ratty 1974+ 911 in desperate need of restoration for a really nice price. Drop in a sbc and start the widebody conversion ;)

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

hey fuckballs, " the Vet get's em wet " :-* , and Quadnie, if you hate Honda so much, why the ---- are you on a Honda baised website ? not to mention that Porsche drivers got small weiners. ;D

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

oh ---- this is a honda based website? :o

I thought this was a discussion group for german shizer porn!

Damn internet is so confusing.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

Why is it that Porsche's are associated with midlife crisses and having a small dick?



I personally like Honda's becuase thats what I like to work on. I know them, they're simple and cheap. You can rebuild the car from the ground up with a 10, 12, 14 17mm wrenches. My buddy's Mustang (which eventually caught on fire due to shitty Mustang fuel lines) is a cluster ---- of metric and standard bolts.


And besides my GSR with under $4,000 in it ran a 12.946 @ 113mph on street tires and stock block. There's nothing like being the underdog.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I had a 1974 porsche 911 with a 383 chevy with trick flow heads and tpi. I bought it with 100,000km on it and blow up the 2.7l and bought a kit from renegade for the conversion. I was going to put a widebody on it, 94 bumpers and side skirts so it looked like a c2 turbo. Sold it to buy a house I can barley afford and now I have crx with a half built hmt setup. Everyone thoght I was rich when I drove that thing, you would have people in 50,000 ford diesels ask me why I would spend so much on a car, I had about 20,000 into mine??? I love that car!

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

See man, that's what I'm talking about! I think I would most likely go for the C4 strosek kit.. u know the one that clones the 993 (including those phat turbo twist rims). The 74-75 911s are nice cause they are nationwide emissionless cars, just keeps the retail value up. My first goal is to find a piece of ---- ragged out 74+ 911 needing the complete restoration cause like I did with my volvo, I will go thru and gut it.. replace the enterior.. who knows maybe I'll just go for the complete frame off approach and sand blast the chassis (after removing the windows of course).

How much did the renegade's hybrid kit cost you? What parts did you buy? Did you mod the gas tank yourself, what radiator did you use? I've heard the kit bolts in like a breeze and they are pretty comprehensive. The factory gearbox on that car can support up to 450hp with the right clutch.. did you buy that from them as well?

As you can see I'm pretty serious in this, gimme details man ;D
-ryan

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I can't remember how much the kit was, I bought the adapter plates, motor mounts and waterpump ---- first, then orderd the rad kit after. I modded the tank my self It was super easy, any one that can weld good would have no problems. I put a drop bottem on mine from jegs for the fuel injection, drilled holes in the bottem with a hole saw and welded the sump over the top, kinda a baffle. I used a 915/16 trans that a local porsche speed shop rebuilt ( trade for the origanal engine) and modded for me, it was still a peg leg because I didn't think to much traction would be good for it. It was drilled and had jets installed it the top with a electic pump to spray oil with a little sump tank and a filter. Cluch was a centerforce dual, and the flywheel was renegades. I might still have the install video if your interested. I would love to get it back or build a new one.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

Here they have a web site now http://www.renegadehybrids.com/main.htm

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

yeah man, i'm definately interested.. I'm hoping to start this 3 year project within the next year (still have other ------- cars that need my attention first).

renegade hybrid never posts prices for their kits.. i saw one on ebay go for $300 once. I figure the conversion kit would be like around a grand.

The gas tank looks easy enough to do, I'm all about doing this project myself, probably have to buy their radiator tho.. they have a good thing re-engineered.

On the tranny, I've heard the stock 911 ones run fairly decent but the 930 trannys can hold up to 700HP with the right clutch ;) I would like to stay right around 400-450, maybe TT that bitch?

Speaking of TT how much room in the engine compartment? You ran a carb right? I was thinking about going fuel injected (ultra megasquirt baby). Was also planning on redoing the interior, dumping the back seat, probably getting some decent race seats or something... definately give the dash a face lift.

How fast was that car? You did you aluminum heads, did it make that much of a difference with weight in the conversion? Man I have so many ------- questions about this thing.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

Heads are 60lbs I think, I wanted to tt mine too, there is lots of room on the sides but ---- all at the back I had tpi, itb's with two big oval k&n's. It was a old hilborn stack system converted to efi (Good old ebay). The engine acullay looked like it belonged in there. The car is very fast, not crazy but very fast. I am not easyly impressed though. The parts are cheep for the small block but wait till you need porsche parts. Go buy an excellence magazine, 5000 brake kits, 5000 dollar body kits, 7500 dollar tranny, bluh bluh bluh. Look at it VERY closely before you start. It makes a very nice car but half the reason I sold mine is because, to finish it the way I wanted it would have cost more than acually getting it up and running. Mine was super clean before I started paint was mint and so was the interior( red on black) I think I was just shy of 400 hp but if I did it again I would not stroke it maybee a 327 or even a 302 zapper, something that can rev with a less torque. You cant use the torque any ways and it light enough you dont need it. Do you want me to look for the install video??????

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

If you don't mind looking for that video, I would really llike to see it.

I know my way around chevy v8s and european cars.. if it weren't for all the damn hondas that keep getting in my way that would be all that I would work on. I am well aware of the porsche pricing.. and no, I wasn't planning on dumping all that money into a stroker. I was thinking of maybe a solid steel 327/350 that can handle boost with no problem. I know what you are talking about where everthing was getting in your way but the setup that I'm going with requires hardly any room at all ontop of the intake manifold.. I'll look for a pic later. The most I would have to worry about would be placement of all the controller boxes that I would need (for standalone ecu, msd, blah blah).. and of course intercooler (or heat exchange if I go the liquid route). I got a lot of ideas but just haven't talked with anyone who has done the project.

I'm aware of the prices, $3500 for body kit, $1000-1500 for tires/rims (used).. I haven't even thought about brakes, would most likely have to go with the 930/993/996 upgrade kits.. I'm familiar with the braking system they use even rebuilding wouldn't be entirely out of the picture for me. You really get screwed when you need specific things like new bushings or dealership items (man the volvo dealerships used to rape me hardcore). For the most part I will be going universal.

Did you keep the heat or a/c? I know renegade hybrids has kits avaialable for anything you want.

Did you have the basic coupe or did you go for the targa?

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I ripped out the a/c and didn't have heat, I was always going to do something with that, they do have kits though.It was a 74 carara(sp) Worth cash but I didn't know at the time so it was a coupe. Porsche diehards will really, really hate you! The intercooler could be a bitch, you would need a turbo wing and mount it under that like a stock 930. A liquid to air might be the ticket but thats two more lines to the front of the car. Cooling is good but not great, turbo might be two much for it. I think the video might be at my momz house (I built it there), I will look tommorow.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I think we high jacked the ---- out of this thread ;)

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

yeah man, this should be retitled to something else... now everyone else is just scared to join in on the discussion. I am aware of the high heat and what a heat exchange would require... I'm sure I'll get creative.

Yeah porsche guys will hate me when I pass them. Here is a pic of the intake setup I was talking about, a lot less space consuming then just a basic single carb and small triangle air filter..
http://www.sdsefi.com/sbman.jpg

no rush on the vid, whenever you can find it.. I'll be around here (as always).

How does the exhaust work out? Did it have to loop around? What mufflers did you use?

I'm sure I have lots more questions on this damn thing.. design is still in my head, I'll have to find a pic of the body kit I want to go with.. it looks really bad ass.

-ryan


EDIT: Now the pic works :)

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

whats the big deal about driving a porsche? expecialy with an SBC. ive driven the 4s 911 and built 700hp 977's that my freinds uncle races. there ok but. i wouldent put all that work into one. but if thats what you realy want more power to you. i want some pretty weird ---- so i guess i cant realy say anything about it.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

You will be suprized how much room on the sides you will have, I cant remember which headman headers I used but it was one muffler cross ways like a stock porsche, dual in dual out looked stock from behind. The best thing I did was used a boat oil pan from moroso for a forword facing flywheel, so when your hard on the throttle the oil stays in the sump. I was going to use a chevy 2 nova pan and pump but the pump didn't clear the stroker crank. Dry sump would be nice since the car has a tank for it stock. That intake will clear but you wont have alot of room for a elbow on the top for turbo. You can get one that has a huge single blade throttle body mounted to an elbow then to an intake like that, might be better? I always wanted the dual over head cam corvette small block for mine. O the Kit uses a strait six balencer, the one with the two v belt groves cut in it to run the water pump( chrysler hemi) and the chevy one wire alt. Would be nice to get a fluid dampner but your s.o.l.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

so did you have your stroker internally balanced?? Man that must have been some serious money you paid there :o

Yeah I'm familiar with how the water pump setup goes and how they say the ls1 motors can't be used within the 911 (save those for a 944 project).

I didn't know about the oil pan issues.. using a nova pan would make the most sense seeing the way they set. I wondered about the muffler setup as well, thinking that pipes would have to loop around somewhere then somehow get a cherry bomb type mufflers.. I'll have to look into that more since I want a complete free flowing exhaust. Man it would suck to have to incorporate catalytic converters into that design.

I heard that the sbc with aluminum heads makes the weigh ratio pretty close. That sucks that your tranny was a real dog legger.. Something limited slip would be nice, then again with the boost most of the power would be made at the top end.

Ya know I can always completely remove the rear seat and extend the sheet metal out some.. but I guess only the transaxle is pretty much behind the rear seat. I would have to make room for a heat exchange and all the boxes anyways.

Did you keep the spare tire where it was at? I know you have to cut a good sized whole in the front to help flow the radiator.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I had no spare tire, it sits on the gas tank a bit and you weld that part up. You could probabaly get a small one in there, It was fully balanced internals with malarey metal pressed into the crank, and some dimples drilled into the flywheel. I would have been better to buy a scat crank instead of converting a 400. You cut the whole nose piece out behind the bumper 2 1/2 feet by 10 inchs? They say to use the stock oil pan but it didn't make sence to me. Cats would suck bad!! If you run block hugger headers you could get a couple of bottles on there and strait out the back. If you went to twin turbos and the down pipes were facing foward and looped around you would have room.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

agreed unless your working on an older car the new v8's suck complete ass to work on. and ill be amaized when they can make a v8 that can get 60+mpg or even as a hybrid. its not going to happen. I own both but i make a very sharp line for what i work on. if its a 73+ V8 ---- that ----. the import for me has taken the place of the new v8's out there and i will never look back.and i dont think $600 will add that much HP to a car unless you went nos.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

imagine working on the new LS2 engine... with the displacement on demand...

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

I agree, ---- working on an LS1.. that just looks like a bitch. Hey onyx, my '86 looks pretty damn stripped down on the inside, it's about as simple as anything below '76.. I took off all that emissions and computer bullshit, went straight up hot rod.. the rest of the truck is as simple as cad racers (minus the turbo and add the 4x4 features).

I wasn't planning on running cats with the porsche, no emissions in arkansas.. but if I were to ever sell it then I would have to consider a cat setup, or at least make the buyer aware that it could be cat-able. But the beauty of a 74-75 is no cars from that era had them installed. I will pick up any year 74-89 as long as the price is right. I've seen them go in rough shape for under $200.

Recently on ebay I saw a '75 with a primered unfishished C4 strosek kit (with the tiny euro lights that I like) with some rice looking ---- on the inside (APC or whatever race seats, rice shifter and stupid stereo). Stock 2.7 (that was leaking oil) and chrome twist wheels go for 15k and that was needing lots of work to complete.

How much did you get as your final price?

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

right now with the price of the car (89 crx si) and turbo kit (t3, drag mani tial WG etc etc etc..)that is about to go on with the cost of the Z6 that is in it now and the VAFC i got a deal on $2000 total.

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

onyx you cock :D

I wasn't talking to you, I was asking High Roller ::)

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

oh sorry :-[

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

well I was kinda misleading, I did say "hey onyx" in the first sentence. Nice to know that your rex only cost you two large.. if anything I want to go for a more ghetto setup.. like 1,500 max on a rex - then turn around and ebay that bitch off for 4 grand! (stripped and looking "race ready" just gets the ricers wet).

Re:honda, truly poor-mans porsche?
 

1900 posts bishes !