Terminator Mode.
 

Feed up with playing with springs and MBCs.
One sweet shortcut.
A Red Button under that dash labeled the terminator.
2$ Air Selunoid from the junk yard. Between the WG and Turbo.
On it works like stock
Throw the switch and signal to the wg is shut off.

Thats stage1.
Next stage is hook up the MAP sensor into the picture. With a small UP down key where you set the PSI you want the wastegate to open.

Here is the pic of the first part.
Map sensorts youve allready seen.
Now just do the pic to switch on and off the selunoid.

http://www.rddreams.com/rddreams/htm...//dscf0082.jpg

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

terminator as in you would terminate your motor?
no signal to the wastegate would mean your turbo would boost to its max without the wastegate opening.
this sounds like a tech write up, but have you done that.
thats not too safe for everyone to try.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

You know, Jeff sent me one of those kia solenoids that looks just like that and I figured thats what it was for.

Now if someone could explain how to hook it up correctly that'd be good.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

You could use a Jacob's switch to turn the solenoid on at X psi. Then wire your switch on the signal going to the solenoid. That way the solenoid allows flow via the jacobs switch triggering it, or you can turn that signal off. Be careful over overboosting.




The best solution in this style would be to use a programmable injector driver to drive one of the more sophisticated solenoids. That way you have TPS, RPM, and an air-flow/pressure signal to tune with, and you can varry the pressure to the actuator all you want. The higher end n2o solenoids have been used in this manner to control the airflow to a wastegate actuator.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

It depends on what kind it is.
This particular unit wont pass air in its default mode. i.e. without anything hooked up its closed.

When you connect power to it. It opens and air flows.

So just plug it in between the wastegate and the signal source.
Power it with a +12 volts off something that only has power when the engine is runing. Route this line past your switch. So turn on key. Valve is open if switch is making contact.
Your riding down the road. And you see that guy with the mag wheels, 12" Tacho and no exhaust. Get into a race with him. Throw your switch. Power to the selunoid is cut.

Please understand. Im sharing what Im doing with my car.
Right or wrong. Smart or Dumb.
Im not selling these units. Nor recomending them.

So dont Jump me.

I have a 1996 8 valve 1.3 LTR car. That weighs 800 Kgs.
And I like taking out the Hondas ;) ;D
So Have to go over the edge sometimes.
Catch my avtar. Then decide if its worth trying anything I try.

Im working on the circuit where we can programe the exact PSI. It works at.
This is very simple really. Let the WG be isolated from the signal line. i.e. power is off. Wait till the map sensor gives you the voltage your waiting for. See the voltage and give the Unit juice opening it and allowing your WG to pop open.
Its that simple.
We could probally do it cheapest if we just went analogue and used jumpers to pick the boost.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Hook it up how? What specifically do you want to do? The solenoid is just an electric valve. The 2 inputs are most likely 12v and ground and opening the circuit to either will probably open/close the valve but that's easy enough to test. Just use an old ATX computer power supply or a 12v ac/dc convertor (the plugs with the big black square deal) I'm sure you have one of them with 12v or if not, hardware stores and rat shack sells multi voltage versions and 12v is always included. I saw one at a Rite Aid pharmacy for $10 the other day.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

good idea

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

See the stupidest thing about this idea is thinking that as soon as a wastegate is open, its going to halt the building of boost. You need a progressive switch (not just on-off) with differrent ramp rates. In this theory it may seem plausable but in reality you will open the wastegate at a preset voltage, the boost will spike, and die off like a mofo then the wastegate will shut and the process will repeat. Your looking at a bumpy boost curve with atleast atleast 3psi variation.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

In its default mode there is no opening. Its used simplly to isolate the WG.

As to the other issue futher down the road that should be stupidlly solved by introducing a preset delay value ;D

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

He's making the electric version, a simple mechanical pop-off valve.
You wouldn't get that thing to control the maximum boost, I don't think that solenoid has pulsed on-off (think injector), or progressive on (like a valve) capabilities.

Like I said tho, it would be great when used in conjunction with a Jacobs switch. Tho you couldn't control overall boost, you could do some nifty things that way.
1) With a Jacobs switch, and your dash switch, you could eliminate wastegate creep - and turn it off completely to run no boost control
2) You could use two Jacob's switches, One set to trigger at a higher boost than the first (the normal). The second would be set at a higher boost level. Also put the second Jacob's on a switch.

What happens, is that with the first (low boost) switch disabled, and the higher boost turned on - you have introduced a boost spike - on purpose. Obviously, with both turned off - you have no boost control, and with the first enabled, you have the original control.


That... Would give you a variable boost option. While peak boost would still be the same, you can obviously introduce boost spikes if you wish - which is not an un-common practice to gain power. Even without the 2nd solution, you could set the Jacob's switch up to introduce whatever boost spike you want. Spikes are not dangerous thing to introduce - as long as the spike is controlled in the manner that you want. (i.e. you allow it to spike, but not so high to be damaging)








I still recommend the use of a Jacobs switch to turn the solenoid on. That will eleminate wastegate creep, while still turning the solenoid on. You may not want to do that tho. Many medium sized (and larger) engine/turbocharger combinations can develop driveability problems if their turbocharger is spooling flat out all the time. The throttle responce can become very, "touchy", to simply non existant. I would doubt it would create a problem on most of the enigne's turboed here. The power levels stay fairly low, and the rpm ranges yall deal with are much broader.





AFA using an injector driver, to control a wastegate - there are a bunch of factory solenoids that are controlled by a pulsed signal. i.e. just like a fuel injector. Using one of the simple fuel injector controllers to control one would give you an extremely cheap electronic boost control. That would be a very fun $200-$350 project for someone.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

lol my budget is 10 bucks. Outa which 8 will probally be spent on the Pic.

Some great inputs and ideas being thrown arround.
I told my mate about interfacing the MAP sensor and he says if your powering on and off one item why not make it two or three. So I say no problem. We will turn on one more and this will go to the cold start injector or maybe 3 and the 3rd witll go to the watter / alky injector.

If I could lay my hands on a cheap Presure sensetive switch all this wouldnt even be required but we dont get them in our neck of the woods and importing is out of the question. This project would work cheaper.

I have just one doubt though. We where arguing about this. He says the cold start injector compress the fluid before injecting it. My point was no way it compreses anything we would need to tap the fuel line for the injector off the FMU output i.e. put a Y cable. One line to the carb and one line to the injector.
Hes like no need man the Cold start compreses the fuel and injects it / has its own pump.

On the WG problem pointed out above. We should be able to come up with a stupid solution to that. like open WG hold open X seconds.
Or even pulse the dam thing to keep it accurate to 1 PSI. Shouldnt be too hard.

Now if I could just find a Presure sensetive s/w that did the on off business for me. I wouldnt need anything else. Just let the Presure s/w turn on or off the selunoid.

On a side note. The solunoid even in its closed possition allows air to flow in one direction on this unit its 10 PSI. So if there where no electronics involved and I just pluged it in as is. My 4psi WG would become a 10 psi WG.

This was discovered by accident we where stress testing the thing to see how much presure it could hold. Went up to 90 PSI no problem. Swaped it arround and after 10 PSI it started passing air. Ive drawn an arrow on it so we know which way to hook it up.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Great job testing the solenoid before hand. Most people skip important things like that!
I still don't think you'll be able to "pulse" that thing quickly enough to control boost in a useable way, but I wish you luck!





I know how you feel on the budget. I got a spare cold-start injector off for my engine off Ebay. Wound up being a $5 water injection project.

You're dead on about cold start injectors, your friend doesn't have a clue. Cold start injectors are nothing more than an atomizer on a stick, with a solenoid in them to cut the flow on and off. When you feed a CSI (normally) 12v, the solenoid opens -> the fluid squirts out, just like any other relay, or solenoid.



Be careful with CSI's. Most of them only flow 100-150cc @ 30psig (a rare few up to 200cc @ 43psig), and I've seen many people forget that! The good news, is that they have superior spray patterns to the atomizers most people use, and since the solenoids don't leak anything (either way) boost can't creep back down un-priming the system!

Not to hijack, but ;)


Starting up to full.

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Re: Terminator Mode.
 

The solunoid can be pusled upto 25 times per second.
How much current does the cold start draw when in open position.
i.e. do I have to use a relay. Or can I just switch it on and off direct. With a trans. The advantage with using a relay is we can swap arround the open or shut bit.

Dam now I have to find a cold start Inj. none of our cars have them. Has to be off an import. Can I use a regular injector. I have arround 30 PSI on my rail/tube.

So you just used a presure sensetive s/w on your project ?
How much do they cost in the US something that can be adjusted to on/off at a preset presure point.

I found something here. But its like 6" by 8" and is used by the Air COn industry costs arround 40$. Way outside my budget.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Most new Jacob's switches cost $15-$25usd.
You can't shoot water through a fuel injector. They will quickly corrode shut. Alcohol will errod the seals among corroding them.
Jacob's switches can't take much current draw. You really need to put them on a relay.

Personally, like I said. I use my SMT-6 to trigger all of my stuff through a relay. I haven't done any tuning in a while, but I think I'm triggering mine at >/=50% TPS, and over 2500rpm. That or >/= 50% TPS, and 2.5v on my AFM. I can't remember. It doesn't trigger running around, but it triggers anytime you're on the gas accelerating.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Na man the cold start is for the fuel enrichment part.
FOr the watter Ing. we will use a regular High Presure pump hooked up to a dial a jet.

Ok feedback from Inital testing. Useing a selunoid which is by default closed and power to open bad idea.

Reason being. These switches heat up like crazy.
Mine got really hot after runing for arround an hour. Now I dont know if it was the hot air from the turbo heating it or the curent keeping it locked open.
TO cut a long story short better if you go for something you dont intend on powering for more than 10-15 minutes.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

remmber all solenoids should be in a cold, free airflowing envornment. they will overheat if near the turbo.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

jeff made one of these

https://www.homemadeturbo.com/forum/...c=9138.0<br />

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Digital boost gauge with Ignition timing and relay switching.
Or just the Wastegate thingie.
Id be intrested in looking at some code if anybody has done something like this.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Chinoy - YAAAAAARR!!!1 If you had red hair and succulent breasts, it would be on.

Toysrme - It's called a Hobbs switch, and they make stainless internaled fuel injectors in the OEM that do not corrode shut. www.myo-p.com has a beta controller board I will be using to keep water injected proportional to injector pulse... not available to the public yet, but soon in inexpensive kit form!

I think the PIC is overkill, could use a simple opamp and solid state relay IC that does not suffer from bounce.

A ~3 psi fuckuation is non-issue for some setups. For $10 solution, who cares? :)

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

LoL
BTW I found an intresting article on Circuitcellular.com

It involves a Pic 16F73 and an MPX4250AP. It backs off your timing based on boost.
Circuit and code included 1$ (From CC)
So by the looks of it I wont even have to bother with the code need to go chk it out. Just paid for it.
Whilte weare at it may as well throw in a Knock sensor.
Now if only I can find one.

If you cant find the article mail me on rdchinoy@gmail.com

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

If I can't find the article? Pay dollar?? *sob*

Ron, check yo PMs! I do not have to pay a dollar for any of the circuit cellar archives, and neither should an enterprising young man like yourself.

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

We Indians have a bad rep for being cheap bastards.
Id prefer to just pay the dollar and keep some self respect ;D

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Your rep can't be as bad as us trailertrash's...

Re: Terminator Mode.
 

Heres the pdf I was talking about.

http://rapidshare.de/files/3071452/P...MPLE4.pdf.html

LOL just sold my first unit to a guy down the road even before finished building it.
Ill post pics of the PCB in a few hours. (At least whats done)

Heres how its shaped up.

1. 2 Line LCD display. I know the 7 segment displays look cooler and is way cheaper but its a bitch to solder up.
2. Default Mode it will display what boost your runing with a Max boost reached shown.
3. On / off upto 3 devices based on boost.
a. Cold start Injector
b. Watter / alky injector
c. Waste Gate Selunoid.
4. Display Air / Fuel readings from a narrow band o2 sensor. Yeah I know WB is the ticket. But I got a few TI O2 sensor amp ICs lying arround and WB is just to complex for a peanut budget project like this.

If I can get my hands on a scope. Maybe back off the timing based on boost.
Just need to get a peek at the wave form generated by the pickup in the distri.

Then disconect the vacum advance and weight advance. And just introduce a delay value to fire where required.