NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

This is going on a street car. The problem with air to water intercoolers is heat soak from interstate driving. Air to air is ok but I have to tune my car every time there is a temp change outside.
I don't want to put NOS on the motor because I have factory internals, and I am not running race gas because its too expensive.

Anyone have any experience with the NX Ntercooler sprayer?

Will it give me below 0 air temps like the air to water would?

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Spraying a $45 bottle of nitrous on an intercooler to cool it down is a complete waste of money and perfectly good nitrous IMO. If its a street car just get an air to air front mount and you'll be fine.


And I don't understand why you need to tune your car everytime there's a temperature change...did you convert that B16 fuel injection to a holly double pumper? MAP sensors are there for a reason

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

just setup the air2water and run a temp guage and then if you're about to hit some trips on the freeway load the cooler w/ ice and just monitor the water temps...

lol

it might get heat soaked after several hours but you have to make stops and ---- for gas so you can just pickup some ice then or whatever

just an idea

nathan

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

i remember reading an article (in Turbo & Hitech perf i think) where they put one on a buick GN and got the intake temps down below ambient air temperature, but not below 0.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

also, wrap your upper charge pipe with heat wrap or cover it with a heat/sound damper material...they sell it at homedepot for like $15...it will keep your upper charge pipe from heat soakin

nathan

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

I have PVC pipes that don't absorb heat well. I am just looking for something to make my tuning consistent. Just 5 degrees difference in temp change keeps my car from running stoich rich or lean. 10 degrees difference and its like I had never tuned it.

Atleast with the Ntercooler I could tune it at that temp and be done with it. I could run a profec B boost controller and have a toggle switch between low boost and high boost. Then have the Ntercooler come on for the high boost run. My inlet pipe is also right behind the intercooler so I will be also getting some NOS in the engine. Nothing like a 50 shot but definitely enough to cool the temps down somemore.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

I think your going to amplify your problem of not being consistent. If you tune it to run with the nitrous, your always going to have to be spraying to be consistent and thats going to get damn expensive

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

You have a temp sensor in your intake manifold for a reason and it should be working. Your map sensor uses RPM, MAP and Temp to calc the mass air flowrate into your engine and hence the pulse duration. AF ratio should NOT depend on temp if your temp gage is reading right.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

I don't have full datalogging capabilities right now because I am using the AFC hack. This NOS Ntercooler sprayer would only be for a high boost setting. Kind of like the Race Gas High boost settings.

I only drive the car once every 3 to 4 months. This is not a daily driver. It is a Race Car with working headlights and tailights.

Maybe I should address the question like this,

"If NOS was the cost of propane, do you think more people would have the Ntercooler sprayer?"

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Ummmmm, fogging your IC with NOS will not get NOS into your engine just by the intake being behind the IC. Even if some did get in there, it wouldn't be enough to make any kind of difference. Just get a FMIC and be done with it. And if its a race-car, then why are you taking long freeway trips with it? I don't get it.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

#1, I am a street racer. Nuff said.

and #2 I already have a FMIC. 28 x 8 x 3.5. Spearco core thats efficient to roughly 700hp.

I am located in the south were its summer time all year round and the humidity is 100%+ everyday.

Are the any pros to the Ntercooler?

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

You sound like you are on MTV's True Life: I'm a street racer. ::)

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

NX has the most retarded idea ever. I've seen people on dsm forums using bent up fuel lines that were drilled every 6 inches drilled and placed in front the the intercooler and hooked up to paintball c02 canister to treat heat soaked intercoolers at autocross. Mounting a paintball canister upside down did something i can't remember. Should freeze over your intercooler and be somewhere in the range of like 60 bucks total if you know how to do it

Edit
-----------
NX is gay and where are you from senor b16killer?

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

http://www.overboost.com/story_intro.asp?id=1257

Turning a 20oz C02 bottle intended for paintball use upside down will cause liquid C02 to come from the bottle, not the gas.

Liquid C02 will indeed freeze it over...or rather cover it in frost. I had a burst disc on one of mine go in the car one time and the carpet instantly turned white from all the frost.

Anyway the cost of a 20oz C02 bottle is $20 or so and it's like $7 to get it filled depending where you go. You can go to places like Big R or sometimes even welding supply stores to get them filled.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

i have heard that CO2 gase may react with oil. and its not good if you get some oil leaks (wich i have =)) or may be this is lie? cos i wanted to do ghetto intercooler sprayer with CO2. it's so cheap there. =)

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

nx ntercooler does not use nitrous, you use c02 not nitrous, and its a good idea, cause I got it.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

did you feel any difference after using it rudeboy?

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

haven't used it yet but I heard great reviews on it, and think about it anyways would you rather have a ghetto can of c02 setup which might be a pain in the ass, and a crappy looking setup, or would you rather have a 5 or 10 lbs bottle of co2 neatly installed, and controlled by a switch and throttle position, for amount of paintball bottles you need to buy, to match the amount of co2 inside of a 10lbs bottle its not worth it. the NX ntercooler kit cost $385. BUT ITS WORTH IT. also chech out DEI. or maybe you can go to the store and get a bag of ice and put it on your intake manifold

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

i am askin again: does any1 know something about reacting co2 with oil?

about gheto settup: i got two nice looking botles with n20 in them for 7 bucks (that not an some nos kit, but just med botles) =) spraer i will do my self from some tubing. feed line will not cost to much. electric valve will cost around 10-20 bucks. it can be activateted from ecu or from a boost activated switch. =)

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

If it does indeed make power, then you would need to compensate with more fuel for the denser air. If you have the kit installed and "feel" the power, yet are not increasing fuel what so ever....placebo.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

thank you tegunderpressure for 1 pro to chill the intercooler. Keep the +'s coming

I believe if you spray the intercooler before you launch and during the entire run, then the air would stay cold netting much denser air resulting in more power and less detonation.

Can anyone second that

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Umm, that was a con... :-\

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Denser air + more fuel = More power!!!


Keep um coming ;)

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Youre right it does. Now what kind of fuel enrichment does the NX kit provide??

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

well my friend, thats completely left to the tuner. A NOS dry kit has no fuel enrichments when activated by the WOT switch, so just as you would tune to a dry shot, you could tune to the denser air from the chiller.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Unless you have nitrous controls with your standalone theres no way to tune for it unless you run it 100% of the time, which you cant.

And a dry kit does add extra fuel, it has to, because it actually adds extra air.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Wow this thread turned instant ricer :X. Most dry nitrous kits "compensate" for the fuel by upping the fuel pressure like a mutha. Nitrous works by splitting up the oxygen and nitrogen elements when it reaches 570 farenheit thus it gives more oxygen to burn during combustion. As everyone has been yapping without compensation of extra fuel for this extra oxygen there is no power to make. Another benefit nitrous creates is it cools the intake temps as nitrous itself is cold : P. Just a personal though on nitrous also is that it can maybe even increase your compression considering that the extra nitrogen content in your engine doesnt just dissapears when it splits.The whole reason you would have something cool over your intercooler is to treat from the symptoms of heat soak without busting out the garden hose(not getting ---- on the track), or at least. As far as having a shitty ass intercooler that just plain doesn't cool worth ---- there is an alternative called water/alcy injection which IMO would be a much better money wise alternative to spraying co2 on your intercooler. I didn't realise the NX ntergayness kit included a solenoid with a WOT switch, a decent idea but would only work on a dyno considering any gains would instantly be negated by your turbocharger sucking up all the CO2 while rolling. The ntergayness can use either nitrous or CO2 as stated on their site : P


The reason i call it the ntergayness is because the fact that ---- was mounted so crooked in 2f2f and the fact that they would even support that movie, hah. Gayness to the extreme^99 :P

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

If you don't have real facts or claims against or for the Ntercooler chiller, then STFU >:( I am looking for real facts on this ----, not how crooked it was in a movie nor what standalone will support a chiller!

I don't have a shitty intercooler and I am only looking on ways to improve ----. For the gay ass bullshit flag raisers, here is a pic of my intercooler so you can see where I am getting at

[img width=700 height=450]http://pic16.picturetrail.com/VOL667/2492508/4936978/62726476.jpg[/img]

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

I see your problem you have a sshitcrome manifold.

And as far as a stand alone... you dont understand tuning

And if this is your "race car that isnt going to be daily drivin" why dont you build the internals and not worry about the nx ntergayness.

I was thinking of programming a micro controller to control water or alcohol injection.

your charge pipes are also really restrictive.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Man, where do I begin?
Edelbrock Whitey, get it right... the Edelbrock is the one that requires constant tweaking - I'm sure Ted will agree with me on this one, I should have got a holley ::)

Okay, I understand what this thing does, for the price you are much better off just making your own. Lots of people use the paintball gun sprayers but come on... $7 to fill them up - ---- that. I have a commercial co2 tank that they call a 20 pound tank and it takes like $7 to get it refilled, works for shielding gas or for a keg setup. Anyways, ---- spending all that money for a rice product when you can make one yourself just as good. They are practical and if I were doing a heat exchange (air2water) setup then I would run it on the radiator that is needed for the heat exchange coolant (which will be a small little radiator/oil cooler).

Now where this gets hazy is when people say that the car is going to suck up what you are fogging on the intercooler.. not very likely, especially at highway speeds.

Another thing that I people forgot to mention is that basic FMIC are worthless when they are heat soaked and stopped in traffic. A heat exchange setup is a lot more efficient, water conducts heat better then anything else. I don't think it's even probable for you to even bring the water to boiling (sealed system) so thus I think it will work more efficiently continually over a FMIC. The science of it can be factored down to a specific point.

Now there are more efficient things like water injection that I would run before you get into all this madness of debating out the intercoolers. You can do whatever you want, I'm just bringing light upon things that you haven't thought about, I don't think there is any reason for people to start panic in here and get into a fight.

now onto my next concern.. what's up with the pvc pipe man? Does that even work? I don't know if that can be called innovative or extreme ghetto. Do tell more.

-ryan

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Thank you senor Quadnie


"It's like 2f2f y0! JDM ----!"

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

I'm not taking your side ya queer.. I'm just calling it how it is and trying to keep the pease ;)

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

the pvc works excellent and is very light weight. I painted it black so it looks like regular pipe. I have already researched water injection, water/methanol injection, propane injection, and alcohol injection. They all cool down the intake charge and help deter knock, but my problem with them is tuning them. I am trying to do everything right the first time.

Propane injection works as an octane booster, which ups 92 octane to 110 and cools the intake air. Problem is, [HOOBS PRESSURE SWITCH] how am I supposed to tune the propane from 5 psi to 30 psi of boost. You can't run the same amount of propane at 5 psi and at 30 psi. If you tune it for 5 psi, then you won't be shooting enough propane for 30psi and vice versa.

Alcohol and Methanol injection, works very well but starts costing money. This is HMT correct?

Water injection is cool but I don't have much room left under the hood. Yes water injection is the cheapest and will cool the intake charge. Problem is the plumbing and the big resevoir.

In a sense, you can run out of anything when spraying it into the engine for whatever reason; I am just trying to find out what works the best within reason of the pocket book. I don't have race gas on tap and don't plan on running it. And I am not running alcohol nor methanol because of the expense. Thats why I am trying to find out if an intercooler chiller is a good idea.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

i was only giving you crap before

but seriously I would go with new eagle rods and lower your compression for the long term and not worry about the chiller. Your fmic should provide enough charge cooling.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

This is HMT and spraying $40 worth of nitrous is not cost effective compared to injecting rubbing alchohol (Denentured Alchohol) which is $1.00 a bottle. Using water injection for a year straight everyday would equal the cost of one nitrous bottle.


As for it taking up too much room under the hood...

http://www.newbieforces.com/files/Wa...lusterfuck.jpg

It doesn't take up any room at all if you mount the resivor in the back.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

very interesting whitey, I may consider the water injection instead of the intercooler chiller.

Water is free, and the bigger the resevoir the longer the water will last you. The tuning will be the same for any other injection, I'll just have the water come on at a certain pressure and tune my fuel from there. It won't chill the air below 0 but it should bring it down below ambient with the efficient intercooler.

Does your water injection get your temps below ambient? Is it best to mount it before or after the intercooler?

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

It has to be mounted after, otherwise the water will just condense in the intercooler, and if the intercooler is heat soaked it will heat up the charge if the water is doing it's job. It's not realistic to aim for super-low charge temps with water injection, water takes space and at a certain point you'll lose power.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

Just remember that water injection works off the principal that when water evaporates its an endothermic reaction and therefore takes away heat. At a certain temp it become ineffective.

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

rubbing alcohol = isopropyl alcohol

Re:NX Ntercooler VS. Water to Air intercooler
 

isopropyl alcohol = Denentured Alchohol (basically, don't make me own you with the chemistry) :-\