Northstar Engines
04-28-2004, 04:56 AM
#11
3.0 BAR
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,365
Re:Northstar Engines
Don't foget about all the drug dealers who drive northstar powered caddys.
Do you already have in your possession the northstart motor or just still in the design phaze? They are considerably more complicated then your average late model vortec motor.
It might be an easier route to go with an aluminum sbc with some aluminum trick flow heads on it, would give you an equal fabrication challenge, and very close in weight to the 4.6L N Star. Finding a custom fuel setup is way easy for an SBC, and you can always do a roller lifter setup for quick revs.
The N Star has a CR of 10.3:1 and sequantial port FI... still sounding boost friendly? A custom sbc you can set to whatever you want for CR and whatever FI setup you want.
N Star has a 90 degree cast aluminum block with cast iron cyl liners + aluminum heads 32v dohc boasting about 300HP and an equivilant amount of torque.. it was more of a high revving motor compared to the rest of the chevy v8 lineup.
You can have any combo with a custom built sbc (----, go for a 383 stroker) and I don't mind OHV that much, no timing belts to worry about breaking.
The pre-northstar caddys had kinda crossblended block that was an aluminum OHV 4.9 that looked like a direct halfbreed of a N Star/sbc.. wierd to say the least.
I might be wrong on this, but I **THINK** that the header design was your standard chevy O__OO__O style on the exhaust ports, I really doubt it was your isometric style headers like you'd see on an ole ford 302 (sbf). I can't remember, but if that is the case, finding turbo manifolds wouldn't be that hard, goto a parts store and compare exhaust manifold gaskets, that would be your key.
I can't tell ya what pistons they used, best bet for that would be the GM dealership.
Weigh it all out Tom, think about maybe going with the LT1/LS1 route (---- get a nice salvaged vette motor out of wrecked pre 97 caprice police cruiser, those bitches flew - that's what we used to do) Or just go with a custom built sbc, the options are limitless with a custom sbc job.
Or.. just build up that 3.8 v6 gen 2 motor that comes stock in half the fieros.
-ryan
Do you already have in your possession the northstart motor or just still in the design phaze? They are considerably more complicated then your average late model vortec motor.
It might be an easier route to go with an aluminum sbc with some aluminum trick flow heads on it, would give you an equal fabrication challenge, and very close in weight to the 4.6L N Star. Finding a custom fuel setup is way easy for an SBC, and you can always do a roller lifter setup for quick revs.
The N Star has a CR of 10.3:1 and sequantial port FI... still sounding boost friendly? A custom sbc you can set to whatever you want for CR and whatever FI setup you want.
N Star has a 90 degree cast aluminum block with cast iron cyl liners + aluminum heads 32v dohc boasting about 300HP and an equivilant amount of torque.. it was more of a high revving motor compared to the rest of the chevy v8 lineup.
You can have any combo with a custom built sbc (----, go for a 383 stroker) and I don't mind OHV that much, no timing belts to worry about breaking.
The pre-northstar caddys had kinda crossblended block that was an aluminum OHV 4.9 that looked like a direct halfbreed of a N Star/sbc.. wierd to say the least.
I might be wrong on this, but I **THINK** that the header design was your standard chevy O__OO__O style on the exhaust ports, I really doubt it was your isometric style headers like you'd see on an ole ford 302 (sbf). I can't remember, but if that is the case, finding turbo manifolds wouldn't be that hard, goto a parts store and compare exhaust manifold gaskets, that would be your key.
I can't tell ya what pistons they used, best bet for that would be the GM dealership.
Weigh it all out Tom, think about maybe going with the LT1/LS1 route (---- get a nice salvaged vette motor out of wrecked pre 97 caprice police cruiser, those bitches flew - that's what we used to do) Or just go with a custom built sbc, the options are limitless with a custom sbc job.
Or.. just build up that 3.8 v6 gen 2 motor that comes stock in half the fieros.
-ryan
04-28-2004, 09:16 AM
#13
1.0 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 489
Re:Northstar Engines
Well I was thinking of an LS1 aswell. IDK if I can find a nice wrecked car with a engine that I could use. LS1s weight more I think as well. Aren't LS1s bigger too? IDK which engine would be better for power in the long run, after boosting and stuff. I am going to do more research tonight when I get home. I looked into the fiero engine as well, and people said that engine sucked and couldn't get it much past 500hp even with a large budget. What do u all think?
Thanks,
Tom
Thanks,
Tom
04-28-2004, 01:19 PM
#14
3.0 BAR
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,365
Re:Northstar Engines
Ya know I got to thinking about it, i think i was wrong on the head pattern for the 4.6 n star motor, it's most likely diff since DOHC vs OHV, but i'm prob right about the 4.9 caddy motor's head design.
Yes, the LS1 are all aluminum (well the ones you're looking at which will be in 95-97 or later GM sports cars), the wieght would be marginal difference, with some searching I might be able to find the exacts. The size should be marginal as well, but the fact that you can get so much aftermarket ---- for the LS1's if it don't fit, you can find an oil pan/distributor that would probably have clearance.
The LT1 ones we used to play with were cast blocks, Generation 3... tough motor.
The LS1 is similar to your basic SBC, but still some differences in contrast to a pre '86 block. I think the LS:1 has a CR of like 10:1 around 350 HP/350 torque, good revving motor. About the hardest thing you will run into doing a hybrid like that is you pretty much need a donor car since there is A LOT of ---- to cross over that you don't realize (and I'm only speaking out of reference for the LT1 swap out of a 305 in a silverado). But finding parts and finding specs would be a lot easier as compared the the northstar.. the whole thing would probably be easier on the wallet in the end with the LS1. I wouldn't pay more then a grand for a used running LS1/LT1 motor, the tricky part is getting the rest of the BS that has to go with it.
---- if you aren't on a budget, just find yourself a custom built raceblock aluminum sbc 350 and build a nice stroker motor, then you can do that custom FI turbo setup or turbo a carb if you want to (not as practical, but possible). I can give ya some twin turbo sbc links if ya want.. or do something new, get a custom "weld-els" manifold hooked up with quad T-25s or something, that would be fun to have a fast spooling quad turbo aluminum sbc, easily be in the 700HP range.
Let me know what ya think, don't forget pics!
Oh, and the 3.8 motors aren't crap, but 500hp would be about all you could get from it, I think a cyclone engine would be a direct bolt in for that car, which a bad *** motor found in the buick grand national/chevy cyclone s10.. I forget which turbo it ran but they were quick and now are rare.
-ryan
Yes, the LS1 are all aluminum (well the ones you're looking at which will be in 95-97 or later GM sports cars), the wieght would be marginal difference, with some searching I might be able to find the exacts. The size should be marginal as well, but the fact that you can get so much aftermarket ---- for the LS1's if it don't fit, you can find an oil pan/distributor that would probably have clearance.
The LT1 ones we used to play with were cast blocks, Generation 3... tough motor.
The LS1 is similar to your basic SBC, but still some differences in contrast to a pre '86 block. I think the LS:1 has a CR of like 10:1 around 350 HP/350 torque, good revving motor. About the hardest thing you will run into doing a hybrid like that is you pretty much need a donor car since there is A LOT of ---- to cross over that you don't realize (and I'm only speaking out of reference for the LT1 swap out of a 305 in a silverado). But finding parts and finding specs would be a lot easier as compared the the northstar.. the whole thing would probably be easier on the wallet in the end with the LS1. I wouldn't pay more then a grand for a used running LS1/LT1 motor, the tricky part is getting the rest of the BS that has to go with it.
---- if you aren't on a budget, just find yourself a custom built raceblock aluminum sbc 350 and build a nice stroker motor, then you can do that custom FI turbo setup or turbo a carb if you want to (not as practical, but possible). I can give ya some twin turbo sbc links if ya want.. or do something new, get a custom "weld-els" manifold hooked up with quad T-25s or something, that would be fun to have a fast spooling quad turbo aluminum sbc, easily be in the 700HP range.
Let me know what ya think, don't forget pics!
Oh, and the 3.8 motors aren't crap, but 500hp would be about all you could get from it, I think a cyclone engine would be a direct bolt in for that car, which a bad *** motor found in the buick grand national/chevy cyclone s10.. I forget which turbo it ran but they were quick and now are rare.
-ryan
04-28-2004, 01:34 PM
#15
3.0 BAR
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,365
Re:Northstar Engines
Originally Posted by Cap
MMM turbo v8. I just bought a 88 LX 4cyl mustang, gonna swap in my 5.0 and turbo that soon. And i'll take plenty of pics as I go.
You gonna do the transmission too? I know those cars had the borg warner T5's in them for the v8 models, but what about the 2.3L ones?
Just wondering how much of a project it was gonna be since those damn 4 cyl 87-93 mustangs are a dime/dozen.
-Ryan
04-28-2004, 02:48 PM
#16
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 17
Re:Northstar Engines
I know a little about these cars. The LS1(5.7l alu block c5 vette motor) is actually smaller(outside diameter) than the northstar. Check out v8archies.com ,they sell mount kits that put smallblocks into v6 fieros. Thats the LT1(5.7 iron block c4 vette). You should think about the ease of install and aftermarket support(parts everywhere)of getting any given motor into your car. The northstar is a very good motor and a few have been put into fieros but I've yet to see a manual trans fiero/northstar. The LT1 cars move nicely, and you don't have to worry about fuel management which is a nightmare with the northstar motor. You can build a 400hp LT1 for 2300$ easily, and tune it with a screwdriver. I hope this helps, and have fun. I've been dreaming about a V8 Fiero for 3-4 years now.
04-28-2004, 03:16 PM
#17
0.5 BAR
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 141
Re:Northstar Engines
THe Northstar Engine or the 3800SC will be the easiest to fit into a fiero. Remember that the Fiero Engine compartment along with the suspension (Struts in the back, multi-link in the front) is pretty much setup like a front engine of a FWD car. It's like a normal front-wheel drive car that you drive backwards with the seats to match. Pretty much any GM powertrain will fit into a Fiero as long as its from a FWD car. Good luck!
04-28-2004, 10:24 PM
#18
1.0 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 489
Re:Northstar Engines
Well I am just gonna check out what i can for the cheapest right now. I would love to get at least 350 but man if i could get a 500hp i would love it. But i have to start working like hell this summer. This sounds like a hard job. Fiero's are RWD, so i have to get a trans to fit that right, would it have to be a trans-axle, or only if i put it longitudal?
Thanks,
Tom
Thanks,
Tom
