Need opinions
 

Dunno how many of you recall my boosted 16V merc.
It´s been running like clockwork as a beater,and the problems i´ve had have been of anything but engine nature.(clutch asf)
Anyways.
Time is up for an upgrade,and i currently run a 64mm inducer schwitzer that has served me very well.

Then i ran across another schwitzer..namely this;

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C00007%7E0.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...l_DSC00006.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...l_DSC00010.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...03/S472MAP.jpg

Anyone on HMT ever try running a turbo of these dimension on a well flowing 2.3liter beater?
Just wanna check if there´s anyone to share experience with here.

Re: Need opinions
 

g/l dude, the vast majority of people on this site believe anything over 1.6 L are gay, i am not one of them

Re: Need opinions
 

On the other hand we´re not shooting for 400 at the crank here either.

Hope to make inxs of 700 without going ape with boost.
Main Q tho is what to be expected from this large a compressor on a motor as small as 2.3 liters.
(Thinking of making the cold side fit to the existing axle and turbine)

Friend is running a 78mm hybrid on his 2.1 liter Audi at 2.9 bars with 1.5 exhaust back.
Point is that the merc motor with its vastly better flow might very well to better at less inducer and less boost.
At least that´s what i´m hoping for.

So..hence why i´m askin if anyone around has tried a BIG ass compressor on a relatively small engine.

Re: Need opinions
 

Short presentation. ;D
Customer of mine cut together a short clip of the rustbucket.
Boost is limited to 1.25 bars.
However due to me being an idiot with the laptop, ign timing in the clip is severly pulled out.
ECU thought we were going for idle all the time as i had sensor trouble with the TPS,leaving me with an ign timing of a mere 8 deg(normaly 23)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnm5Pg6ceaw

Re: Need opinions
 

Re: Need opinions
 

by looking at that compressor map, I would say you would definately have to be shooting for some insane hp numbers...otherwise, it would be way too big. Maybee Blaast would have an opinion on that map?

Re: Need opinions
 

thats a big mother fucker right there. :o

Re: Need opinions
 

Yeah,we´re shooting for over agerage numbers this time out.
Recepie is for the huffer in the pic of course.
A 60mm HKS rip off
2" stainless primarys on 1.5mm thickness(leaves us with 47mm innards),on approx 650mm length.
4" downpipe and 3.5 from there on back.

Engine is filled with "sane" parts(Ie;screw the bling crap)
Carillo rods.
Mahle slugs
Ferrea valves

But most of all...parts made by us(and conrods as well as slugs had to be modded by us too)
Sticks are a pair of 288deg on 12.5mm lift.
Will be installed on a fairly tight LCA seing boost is involved.

Intake is something we fab ourselves from aluminium stock.

Turbo has been modded today to take a KKK exhaust housing as these are more commonplace,and therefore much easier to get a hold of in various A/Rs(Altho KKK doesn´t quote their housings in A/R.Only area)

Intercooler will be a handbuilt unit by us as well based on the old garett element,but with emphasis on well flowing end tanks asf asf.

Throttle body of 83mm off the V8/Yamaha Volvo.

Diffusor plenum-as earlier.

We try n pay attention to detail as best as we can.
For instance..

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...l_DSCN0144.JPG

Homebrew weldbung with o-ring recess for the compressor outlet.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...l_DSCN0145.JPG
Modded K29 exhaust housing.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...l_DSCN0096.JPG
CAD for homebrew titanium/alumek retainers.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C_0009%7E4.JPG
Piston coolers.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums..._Styrning2.JPG
Homwbrew JM3 bearing bronze valve guides.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...entilurtag.JPG
Modded Mahle slugs to take 14mm valve lift.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C_0010%7E5.JPG
Ferrea valves.Originaly for motorcycles,but come "semi" finished.We cut the keeper groves and make them the correct lenght needed.

Aso aso aso.

Q still stand tho.
Is there anyone around HMT with experience of running bigger sized huffers on relatively small engines?
If so,what was the outcome?

Re: Need opinions
 

nice looking setup, sell me the old turbo ;)

Re: Need opinions
 

yeah this turbo looks comparable to a garrett gt 4202.
600-900 HP shouldn't be a problem with this.
But spool up wize, not sure... i would definitely start with a super low turbine a/r !!

Re: Need opinions
 

Speaking of spool.
Altho we don´t expect anything of importance to happen until 5 grand we´ll probalby get to shift the other side of 10 000 anyways.

None the less.
Have any of you guys investigated the effects for instance of oilpressure for a journalbeainged turbo when on bigger sizes?
What I/we plan to do amongst other stuff is install a pressure valve in the hardline leading for the turbo to look further into this.
Schwitzer says that OP should be kept to 30psi at maximum load,but wouldn´t that also be dependant on pressure spikes,amount of boost and backpressure?
..and what´s more..if Schwitzer says 30 psi(i believe 7 psi was the ticket at idle) then i guess that´s at least a safe limit.

Further,of course we´re going to run twin entry,and as stated on approx 600mm+ primary lenght of 48mm innards.
Cams are there to make it happen around the 5 grand mark.

We hope for at least a driveable car underneath the boost line,and we´ll just have to examine what can be done above i guess.

That the cold side will suffice a bit..is clear.

Re: Need opinions
 

Things are progressing.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C00002%7E2.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...rmal_7%7E0.JPG

Made out of Inconel alloyed stainless steel.
Not exactly modestville anymore..

Seing the intended rev range of this SOB(approx 11 grand),primarys are 55*2 and primary lenght come in at approx 700mm.
4" downpipe.

Re: Need opinions
 

[quote=Racing ]

Christ, baller ass manifold materials... Really necessary at that kind of hp? Thought inconel was for those going up near 2000 or so ??? Nice bling though

Re: Need opinions
 

holy ----

M-Bs rawk!!!

Re: Need opinions
 

Nah.Not really.It´s mainly to shove down the throat of customers at the shop.
Dunno as far as bling...to me Inconel is racing.
In fact i absolutely loathe bling.I friggin piss on it...to the letter.

Thing is that we set this engine up to take it to go balls to the wall if needed.
Ie;hedder amongst other parts are built to take even higger huffer and power.

Re: Need opinions
 

Slap af den motor ser fed ud.. :o

Hvad regner du med af heste? Det udstødningsmanifold ser fedt ud, er det ikke svært at finde ud af hvordan det skal løbe?

Hilsen
Jesper Andersen, DK

Re: Need opinions
 

WTF ??? Need pic's of the car/ set up that is on there know.

Re: Need opinions
 

Jesper.
Vet faktiskt inte,utan tar det som det kommer.
Tanken e att den skall upp i bromsbänken hos en god vän när den e färdig,å vi har som sagt 3 kallsidor till den.En på 72,en på 76 å en på 80mm.
Samma skit detta med jätte effekt nummer...till en grad mindre intressant eftersom det hela skall hamna i en gatbil.
Därför kommer jag använda den största kallsida som ger mig hygglig kurva-för körbarhetens skull.

Men..över 800 skall vi väl iaf hoppas jag.

Jo.
Att lista ut hur primärpiporna skall dras tar sin tid.Speciellt i ett material som inconel iom kostnaden.Man vill ju liksom inte göra bort sig.Inconel e fö vansinnigt svårbearbetat.

Jesper


...and that my fellow HMT;ers is some viking 101 for you.. ;D

Re: Need opinions
 

Glæder mig til at se hvad effekt du ender på..

Hvor var det du kørte streetrace henne? Kunne være sjovt at se den IRL en dag...

Jesper

Re: Need opinions
 

Ja,bor du på själland är det inte så långt...då jag bor i göteborg.
Sen...råkar det vara så att jag är halvdansk dessutom ;D,å har mina rötter på christianshavn..(familjen bor fortfarande där å ute på amager).
Så det händer att jag får upp danska kunder åxå.
Vet inte om du sett en EVO 190a i köpenhamn?
Kim,som äger bilen,e en mkt mkt trevlig man....å jag har bla installerat VEMS i den.

Re: Need opinions
 

Btw.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_24.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C00002%7E5.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_31.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_32.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C_0001%7E7.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_39.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_49.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_50.JPG
(Exhaust side for the sake of comparsion vs stock)

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_51.JPG
(Intake)

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C00001%7E5.JPG

(Base for new diffusor plenum box of approx 4 liters and the intake runners we´ve turned in the lathe)

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...C00005%7E0.JPG

(Full radii of course)

Re: Need opinions
 

Kommer ikke så meget i KBH, bor 35 km derfra.. Hvilke dage bliver der kørt ræs i göteborg? Kunne godt være jeg hev fat i dig omkring sommer for at høre nærmere. Det tager jo ikke så lang tid med færgen derover.. Men der er alligevel 240 km derop... :(

Hilsen
Jesper

Re: Need opinions
 

enough of that filthy pig latin

Re: Need opinions
 

Bullshit.
You´re just full of envy as you wanna get in on the gaytrain...

Jesper.
Ja.Vill du så löser vi så du har ngn stans att sova mm...inga problem.
Rejsen kan jag meddela ung en vecka i förväg.
Ngt vi löser underground via ngt som heter racecommunity.

Mvh;Jesper

Re: Need opinions
 

Ngn= nogen? ngt=nået?

Lyder ellers fedt nok, ved du ikke om du har været på Striben KBH men sker som regel ikke det store.. Og flere jeg kender snakker om at streetrace i Sverige er lige en tand federe.. :P

Hilsen
Jesper

Re: Need opinions
 

Ngt=något.

Ja.Visst.Du kan alltid ringa mig.
737-189010 å naturligtvis med 46 framför.

Hade varit kul om ni var några stycken!!

Körningarna,när de nu kommer igång igen efter vintern vilket brukar vara sent i mars eller tidigt i april,ske ungefär var 14e dag.

Re: Need opinions
 

either ------ translate that ---- or i'll abuse internet translators to figure out what gay porn you're talking about :)

Re: Need opinions
 

Honestly?
We´re talking of him getting in on the illegal streetracing up here.(He lives about 200 miles south of me)
So..i basicaly invited him up here.
The streetracing scene around here looks a little different than does it in the US.
No moneys involved,cops don´t really care..and we do our thang.
What´s more is that there´s really no rivalry involved from that sense in any way.
By euro standards sweden is where it´s at streetracing wise i´d say.
Seing how few that live here..there´s a lot of people involved.
Not uncommon for a thou to show up for a race.

Re: Need opinions
 

Update.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_86.JPG

Valve springs to take us the other side of 10 grand came in.
Retainers-not the shims in the pic-are made out of a local alloy by the name of Alumec.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_70.JPG

New 3 disc Sachs 184mm clutch.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...10003/Hub2.jpg

Center bolt hubs for the speedline magnesiums we´re gonna use.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...DSC00002~6.JPG

Oilfilter adapter for OEM filter.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums.../normal_67.JPG

Brake upgrade

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_105.JPG
http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_106.JPG

New rails.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_110.JPG

Building on the OEM intake is a no-go,so we started by laser cutting this as a template.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_115.JPG

Which evolved to this in the multi axis...

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_117.JPG

...for a more straight shot

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_119.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_120.JPG

Natrualy we can not complete this project without a knurled knob for the PS pump

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_132.JPG
http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_137.JPG
http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_138.JPG
http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_139.JPG
http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_140.JPG

We opted to go with a 80mm TB off of an aftermarket setup for a BBC 502.
Intake is again setup to be of diffusor type.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_167.JPG

Picked the new car up,and have spent some serious time straightening the chassis out.
Chassis is basicaly done and awaits the new drivetrains as is.
Delrin and uniballs all over the place.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_181.JPG

Launch control and shiftcut to be used.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_186.JPG

...couldn´t resist... ;D

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_193.JPG

Transmission issues made us opt to install this as we need to both cool and spray the LE600 series oil where it need to go in the box to make it survive.

Re: Need opinions
 

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_220.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_222.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_223.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_224.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_226.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_236.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_235.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_230.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_259.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_258.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_260.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_264.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_263.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_266.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_267.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_276.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_277.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_278.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_279.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_280.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_283.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_281.JPG

Finishing to come....

Re: Need opinions
 

------- baller. front page vote

Re: Need opinions
 

Awsome injector placement :y

Re: Need opinions
 

Yeah.
We expect that to take some serious trial n error.
Have played around with staging b4 tho,and have made it work well.

Works continues on a daily basis at the moment as i want to get the engine done.

It´s all about details tho..

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_284.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_285.JPG

As it´s a streeter i want to retain the OEM thermo for the oilcooler.-10 bungs have simply been welded in.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_286.JPG

The small clamps make for a big differnce when keeping AN hose in check.
Fitting are the el-chepo chin chong ones btw.

That aside...it´s mainly home brew.
Down to stuff like fuelrails asf.

Re: Need opinions
 

+1....What an awesome ride man. I've NEVER seen a Mercedez quite like that. I'd like to pull up next to a Z06 Corvette or a GT500 in that car.

Re: Need opinions
 

This is almost too Fancy and high dollar for HMT. :o

---- looks awesome

Re: Need opinions
 

Thanx guys.
To be honest tho it´s more about labour than dollars.
Then again,it´s what i do.
It´s become sort of an issue that the stuff we put on the motor is "made in abro"(where we have the shop) and not some ready made bought crap.

Over here the cossie merc isn´t exactly expensive as it´s kind of domestic to us.(Altho that is changing as the car is turning collectable)
Has great potential for tuning though.

Radiator for instance is an element intended for a US sprint car,and then we´ve just welded the end tanks and bungs to it.
Intercooler was a bitch as the element is a ching chong meow,and the aluminium in that isn´t exactly a dream to weld...seems like its done from recycled ld cola cans from the phillipines!

Coming up shortly is home made pulleys asf.Nothing much of that stuff available for this engine aftermarket which leaves us to make the parts ourselves.

Re: Need opinions
 

2nd stage injectors are ment for a jap car.
Brings that their seals are in axial.
To make the seal adjustable in pressure we came up with this simple idea.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_289.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_287.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_290.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_291.JPG

Also got the very high tech "Alumec" delivered that we´re going to cut valvespring retainers from.

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_293.JPG




http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_297.JPG

Audi spent big bux developing the diffusor idea for the 4 and 5 bangers,and we´ve used them before with great success.

So..diffusor time.
Diffusor in turn lead up to a 80mm TB which is an aftermarket setup for a BBC 502.

Re: Need opinions
 

Solid work! Welds look really good and overall everything is looking strong. I'm not too keen on your turbo selection, but if you're intent on only making power above 6k then so be it. I guess when you're racing you don't see low rpm anyway. I foresee a high throttle only tuned beast that rapes exotics.

I'm sure you'll have some fun getting it all sorted out, but it sounds like you have loads of experience and will eventually pull it off. I'm blown away by your ingenuity and thinking outside the box. You're obviously a genuine car/fab guy, so enjoy the fruits of your labor. I wish you wouldn't have mated Chinese parts with your own custom parts made from quality materials, but I do understand saving money where you can. Seriously man, best of luck with that thing; it's badass.

Re: Need opinions
 

A sincere thanx.


http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_302.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_303.JPG

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_304.JPG

Diffusor setup is getting there.
Like the tuned pipe of a 2 stroker..

Re: Need opinions
 

That Alumec rod up there...turned into this today.
Fresh out of the CNC lathe..

http://www.102983.org/gallery/albums...normal_306.jpg

Retainers....to rev to the moon with our own swedish spring steel valve springs to compliment..
A trip to the anodizing bath remains tho,and the net result of that is a retainer with a hardness of RockwellC 65...
No..for those into the loop,that is not a misprint.
Anodized Alumec will carry a hardness of Rockwell C scale 65...
To my knowledge the only tool room aluminium in the world...with a fatigue strenght way way way beyond anything else out there.