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i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
before anyone trys to persuade my not to do this, dont bother. this is what i have wanted for a while and no one will change my mind.
this spring i am going to build a 84mm b16 w/ a P8R head. the only part i am unsure of is the dowels and oiling. from what i understand it would be the reverse of doing an LS-Vtack. i would need to plug teh extra oil ports on the b16 bottom end. my question is what do i do about dowels?? do i even need them? the build will end up like this 1707cc Low-Tec B16 9.2:1 CR 84mm B16 bottom end Tuner toys rods Wiseco 84mm +2cc dome pistons (unless craig can get me some SRP's with the right specs) B20B P8R head crower springs and ret webcams custom cams, unsure of exact specs, ~460-470 lift, 268int/230-240ex dur mainly for extended RPM range claiming 3 dependants on taxes pwns you :8 |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
its been done lots before, I think you need to drill the dowles in the head and block off the oil. I think the head gasket would block the oil anyways but a plug would be nice to make sure. Cheapest b series ever ;)
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
i hve seen a few thread on HT about it but it doesnt go into much detail about the dowels. what do they actually do?? if i dont absolutley need them i wont bother but if i do need them i dont know that to do about them
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
I do believe you just drill the head like for a ls/vtec, just the other two (the small ones).
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
So its going to be sleeved right? 84mm aint gonna happen on a stock b16/b18 and Pr4/P75 heads are boat anchors.
Anyways to answer your questions, yes you need dowls, you'll need to drill the backside of the pr4/p75 head. And I dont think there are any other things you have to do, the oil should be fed through the middle oil oriface. No offense, but this sounds kinda stupid.. I think the only reason a block should ever be done like this, is if you already have these parts laying around and you need to slap something together using stock parts. But actually buying Forged internals and trying to build something like this?... eh I dunno man sounds like a wate of time. :X |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
its a p8r head not a standard ls/b20 one. 84mm comb chambers and 33mm int valves. it has been flowbenched and flows within 10cfm of a b16 head.
if it turns out shitty (which i doubt) i can sell the block and have enough money to buy a b20 bottom end and new rods and still put a few dollars in my pocket |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
Even if the P8r head has 84mm comb chambers you wont be able to use 84mm pistons in a stock sleeved b16a, and running forged pistons in a B20 is just a ticking timebomb. Siamese monolithic designed sleeves maybe bigger than b16/b18 sleeves but are by far the weakest of the bunch.. 300whp wont even last.
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
its def gonna be sleeved i might be on crack but i'm not stupid
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
maybe a little of both.. lol ;)
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
do you already have a b16a head? i mean i understand that the p8r head flows close to a b16 ive seen the research ( i want one myself for my b20) but its really not about flow. if you really dont like vtec they make aftermarket rockers that allow the use of only the vtec lobes and reduce valvetrai weight.
the main drawback isnt really any 1 of the parts you want to use its the combination. seriously a sleeved 84mm b16 will want to be revved to at least 9k maybe more. a p8r head as good as it will flow still has LS rockers that cant support rpms much over 8k. unless you have a solid proven idea how to get more rpms out of the valvetrain (ive already thought of how to make roller followers work so no copying me :y) i woulndt start this idea. seriously the b16 head has a better oiling system than the ls , heavier duty cam caps, and shaft mounted rockers. for high rpms go with a b16 head. now if you want to put a LS crank in there with custom pistons now were talking. no real need to go over 8500 rpm's and youll make sick tq. AND youll still have a b16 block with p8r head. youll certainly suprise some people with that. feel free to IM me or whatever if you want, i got a good deal of non vtec experiance. |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
one idea to help the b18b head, custom make something like this
http://www.tomei-p.co.jp/_2003web-ca.../e099_ras.html |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
Originally Posted by Jcushing
do you already have a b16a head? i mean i understand that the p8r head flows close to a b16 ive seen the research ( i want one myself for my b20) but its really not about flow. if you really dont like vtec they make aftermarket rockers that allow the use of only the vtec lobes and reduce valvetrai weight.
the main drawback isnt really any 1 of the parts you want to use its the combination. seriously a sleeved 84mm b16 will want to be revved to at least 9k maybe more. a p8r head as good as it will flow still has LS rockers that cant support rpms much over 8k. unless you have a solid proven idea how to get more rpms out of the valvetrain (ive already thought of how to make roller followers work so no copying me :y) i woulndt start this idea. seriously the b16 head has a better oiling system than the ls , heavier duty cam caps, and shaft mounted rockers. for high rpms go with a b16 head. now if you want to put a LS crank in there with custom pistons now were talking. no real need to go over 8500 rpm's and youll make sick tq. AND youll still have a b16 block with p8r head. youll certainly suprise some people with that. feel free to IM me or whatever if you want, i got a good deal of non vtec experiance. only thing is to get a LS crank to fit is you half to remove the oil squirters and clearance the block. Also this in turns causes a problem. The stock stroke of that motor was 77mm and now is a monster 89mm - this means that the piston would go past the block deck. there are 2 logical ways to fix this. have some custom shortened rods made (which will hinder rpms even more) or have the B16 sent to ERL performance and have the superdeckII performed. they will put in dart sleves bore it to 84mm and grind the appropriate deck to have off the shelf rods fit. The second decision would be the bes cause you get 2 birds with one stone. just my 2c. |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
Originally Posted by Importordomestic
Originally Posted by Jcushing
do you already have a b16a head? i mean i understand that the p8r head flows close to a b16 ive seen the research ( i want one myself for my b20) but its really not about flow. if you really dont like vtec they make aftermarket rockers that allow the use of only the vtec lobes and reduce valvetrai weight.
the main drawback isnt really any 1 of the parts you want to use its the combination. seriously a sleeved 84mm b16 will want to be revved to at least 9k maybe more. a p8r head as good as it will flow still has LS rockers that cant support rpms much over 8k. unless you have a solid proven idea how to get more rpms out of the valvetrain (ive already thought of how to make roller followers work so no copying me :y) i woulndt start this idea. seriously the b16 head has a better oiling system than the ls , heavier duty cam caps, and shaft mounted rockers. for high rpms go with a b16 head. now if you want to put a LS crank in there with custom pistons now were talking. no real need to go over 8500 rpm's and youll make sick tq. AND youll still have a b16 block with p8r head. youll certainly suprise some people with that. feel free to IM me or whatever if you want, i got a good deal of non vtec experiance. only thing is to get a LS crank to fit is you half to remove the oil squirters and clearance the block. Also this in turns causes a problem. The stock stroke of that motor was 77mm and now is a monster 89mm - this means that the piston would go past the block deck. there are 2 logical ways to fix this. have some custom shortened rods made (which will hinder rpms even more) or have the B16 sent to ERL performance and have the superdeckII performed. they will put in dart sleves bore it to 84mm and grind the appropriate deck to have off the shelf rods fit. The second decision would be the bes cause you get 2 birds with one stone. just my 2c. |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
i think all the ideas mentioned are ways to make a b16 block into an LS block and are very expensive. why not just buy an LS?? i want a high revving non v-tec block. the rocker "gaurd" thing is a decent idea though.
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Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
i agree that this sounds stupid.
no offense |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
u said it urself that this head flows 10 cfm less than a b16
if u really wanna use the head use the b20 block |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
B18A/B + 3G Prelude intake valves = poor man's P8R.
I agree, flowbench numbers have nothing to do with the actual performance of the head itself... that's why an 11:1 CR unported LS head with Crower 404's revved to 7500 makes as much or more power than an 11:1 CR ITR with factory mild ported head and factory equivalent cams revved to 8400, both with comparable bolt ons... and the LS makes a ---- ton more power below peak than the ITR. Up to 180 whp in NA form, the LS gives you the same peak power and a lot more under the curve. Apply that NA LS knowledge towards a boosted setup... hrm. Starts looking like a waste of money, unless you rev the engine out some more. They make rocker retainers for LS, similar to the SR20 stuffs, but and LS head is just not as suited to the rpms as a B16/GSR head, as others have mentioned. Wait, isn't the highest power made off of a completely stock LS head on a built bottom end in the 700-800 whp range? So, we can infer for practical applications, trying to make a B-series head flow better for forced induction is a big fat waste of time and money. Save that ---- for the NA guys. |
Re: i'm on crack....P8R head on 84mm b16 block. knowlegde only...no faggot HT haters
they make pistons with a raised pin so you can run an ls crank in a b16 block. why do this when you can just buy a b18b block for cheap? sole reason is so it looks like you have a b16.
and yes stock for stock the p8r head flows 10cfm less than a b16a BUT it flows alot more than a b18b (~20 cfm). a performance valvejob alone will make it flow on par with any stock vtec head. and yes you can put oversized intake valves in a LS head and they make them up to 2mm over honestly if you want a high revving non-vtec block look into web cams or phantom grip rockers in a b16a head |
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