E-85 experiences?
 

I am nearly finished with my build z6 and turbo setup, and I have been seriously thinking of running e-85. I have talked to a few and read up alot and the only thing holding me back is supposedly the octane rating in it can fluctuate. I know it requires about 30% more fuel to be injected and alcohol burns twice as fast as just gasoline, but with the cooling effects and the 105 octane rating the more I think about it the more I like it.

Post up if you use it or have used it, do you like it? do you know about how much the octane really fluxuates? is it a big deal? I'm building this for between 300-325 but would also like to see 400+ when I take it to the strip.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

WTF is this e85 ---- everyones been talking about? We aint got that in JDM land...is it something I should look forward to in a couple of years when I come home?

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

I would go with e85 as long as theres lots of gas stations that have it around you. In Florida theres like 3 stations near Daytona that have it and there all about 30 mins away.
i heard it deteriorates fuels lines tho.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

there is a MAJOR issue with E85......

It's not always E85 :)

In Ohio E85 can be between 85/15 and 70/30 at the pump. You'll have to take a fuel sample at every fill-up, hope you know how to use the bobber :)

Your gonna need 50-70% more fuel. To be safe double the size of your injectors.

I plan on going with 42lb SVO injectors for my NA D15 @ 13.7:1 compression, likely will get the fuel for free just for running a sticker. Yes I might have a sponser already! Krogers manager said a $25 gift card for fuel would be easy.

Really, how much E85 you think I'm gonna burn in a season?

About the rubber lines......I won't have that problem with a 2 gallon fuel cell mounted up front :)

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

Yes, I know about the lines, I am installing a fuel cell in the trunk and running new lines. another question I had is will a walbro or xenocron 255lph pump support 400 hp with E85? I'm thinking its really pushing it. when you run a fuel cell do you put the pump in the cell or in line?

What is this bobbler you speak of? where can I get one?

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

from what i have heard on e85 is a pretty high octane, comparable almost to 110. its 85% ethanol which is made from corn. this video i found a while ago was pretty sweet. guy made 500+ horsepower on it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY_S5...elated&search=

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

Yeah the octaine is somewhere around 105 from what i've found, but is not always the same, thats what i'm worried about.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

well if it were 70 30 what would the octane be around - 95-97? you're probably better off just getting a tune on 93, unless you live in the corn fields

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

I pretty much do live in teh corn fields, northeast wisconsin, lol. I am the tuner so its not a problem to retune it for me. but I just dont want to have to do it for every tank of gas.

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lol, a hydrometer, why didnt you say so, I use them quite often.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

.... in making alcoholic beverages, drugs, and explosives, right?

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

measuring specific gravity of batery acid in lead acid aircraft batteries.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

You could see it but instead of making it out of corn they would make it out of rice :y seriously.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

I run e85 currently. Someone said they use 50-70% more fuel, where'd you get those numbers? I am currently making 366AWHP with e85 on 23psi on a PTE SCM50 turbo on my talon.

As far as fuel pumps, I run an intank Walbro 255hp that is not rewired. Another local guy reached the limits of his Walbro 255hp on his 2.3L Talon at around 25psi on an SC61 turbo. You should be fine making 400hp using the Walbro 255hp.

As for injectors, you might as well just buy the largest ones that you can reasonably control with whatever management you are using. I am running 1600cc PTE injectors. It's overkill for my setup, but I have the means to control them and turn them down, and it leaves me with room to upgrade in the future.

As for tuning, I use DSMLink, and adjusted my global setting up about 30% from where they were, and that has worked fairly well for me.

I didn't change out any fuel lines or do anything special like that. I'm still on a stock gas tank, stock fuel lines. There's been enough people that have been running this and not seeing the damage that it was supposidly going to cause, that I am comfortable with running it as is.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

Thank you for the response, thats what I was looking for, do you have a wideband on it? and do you notice you're afr's change from tank to tank?Thank you.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

I do have a wideband, the PLX-M300. Because the mixes change, I find it very useful to have a wideband, and a functional knock sensing system. That way I can monitor how the motors performance has changed in case the ethanol mixture has changed. Stoich is different with E85 than it is with regular gas. But you still aim for the same AFR's on E85 since the units are calibrated to read gasoline. I am right now aiming for a constant 12.0 AFR. It seems on DSM's at least, going much more leaner then 12.5 doesn't net much more for gains, but adding timing is where the power is made. So I am basically aiming for a 12.0 across the board, and then just adding timing from there until I start to see knock.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

excelent, thanks for the info. I am running that same wideband, what kind of mileage do you get?

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

Well take into consideration I've been running the car pretty hard, trying to get it dialed in at WOT. My last couple tanks I've averaged about 20mpg vs. the 25mpg I'd get on 92 gasoline. Milage did go down, but performance went way up, and e85 is on average 45cents cheaper then regular, 65cents cheaper then 92.

Re: E-85 experiences?
 

nice, its not like its a big deal anyway but I thought it would be alot worse.

whats all needed to run e85 safely i herd its better for the turbo set up

General Tuning Forum - Innovate Motorsports Forum

The innovate forums have a lot of good information if you search for e85 and e-85. You don't even need to sign up to read/lurk.

well e-85 does make your combustion chambers nice and clean and when you run rich doesnt smell nearly as bad behind the car also i would think that it makes all of the parts after the combustion cycle stay cleaner longer because the fuel burns so much better

Have you thought about a water/meth injection system? You'd have more control of the mix.

what happens when you run out of water meth when your out cruising?? plus it gets kinda expensive

Snow Performance: 7 Gallon Reservoir

I want to see that in somebody's hatch.

I would say, if you are happy with what you can do on pump gas for daily driving, then stick with it.

If you want to run max effort fuel, save up for the race gas and use it on the weekends/track days.

i've been running it for about a year and a half now on my MR2. setup is:

stock toyota MR2 turbo pump, lines, regulator; top feed camry/5SFE fuel rail, WRX decapped injectors (750cc/min), 15psi boost tuned on CROME/P75 ECU. makes about 300whp at 15psi. the stock pump can't flow any more fuel so i can't turn the boost higher than that until i throw an 044 in there.


not really a problem. the more gasoline in the mix, the richer the mix runs in open loop (safer). in closed loop, the ECU can easily compensate for mixture variations up to about 15%. the "octane" rating of ethanol comes largely from the latent heat of vaporization, so a 70/30 mix is still comparatively high octane. i've yet to get it to knock on my setup.


no. good god no. i added 22% global and it fired right up. tweaked it another 1-2% and the mixtures fell right in line.

mileage-wise, i see between 20 and 26 depending on how i drive. i have it tuned to 17:1 at steady state cruise above idle RPM (and i can probably go leaner with hotter plugs), and it stays about 13:1 up until about 5psi. this not only helps spool the turbo, but it reduces the amount of accel enrichment that happens when you go up hills, etc, while on the highway. saves an amazing amount of fuel, and there are zero signs of detonation. i'm pretty sure i could stretch it to almost 30 if i were just on the highway and was very conservative with the loud pedal.

cold start can be a bitch, but if you go about 20% richer in cranking/warmup than you think you should, it will usually run perfectly. i've never had a non-start on E85 down to about 35*F. i don't drive the car when it's colder than that anyway.

check your fuel filter after you run it for about a week. some cars (DSM's especially) will clog the filters REALLY quick, some (toyota) will never seem to clog it. maybe toyota filters don't filter as well as DSM do. either way, keep an eye on it.

scarecrowX - WOOT!

Side note about DSM fuel filters. They suck stock. They flow nicely and all that hoopla to a point, but if your tuning a DSM seriously, replace all the fuel lines tank up. 40 shops out their make a kit to do this and running a 6AN or 10AN aftermarket filter will make you happy over the long run vs. a stock filter.

Word to the wise :)