car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

ok, i have been bumping since I was 16 (im now 30).

however, my question is one that requires a bit more knowledge from people. Here is the situation....


I have 2 15" DVC 4ohm subs i am hooking up to an amp. the amp is rated 480rms x 2 at 2 ohms, or 960rms x 1 (bridged) at 4 ohms.


the question is, which configuration is the best way to wire the subs/amp?


example 1 - bridge each sub down to 2 ohms, wire up each sub to its on channel, seeing 480rms per sub x 2 channels
example 2 - bridge each sub down to 2 ohms, then wire the subs up in series to a 4ohm load to the amp, seeing 960rms total x 1 channel
example 3 - run each sub in series to 8 ohms, then bridge the subs and run bridged on the amp in a 4ohm load, seeing 960rms total x 1 channel



or does it not matter how it wires up because mathmatically, all 3 ways are seeing the "same" power? if this is the case, is one way or another "better" for the amp, as in efficiancy?


thanks.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

i would go with the sub setup in example number 2. i always bridge my amp, its puts a higher load on the amp and decreases its life span slightly, but i think it sounds much better. more or so depends on the sub quality when it comes to sound though.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

subs parallel
amp bridged

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

that doesnt help.

example 2 and 3, at some point, the subs are ran parallel, and the amp is bridged in both examples as well.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Only thing with running it at a lower ohm is you will get more heat build up and possible distortion. Since you will be getting the same wattage running it bridged at 4 ohm I would go that route.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

ok, i do agree with that.

4ohms bridged it is.



now onto which way is better for wiring the subs to get 4ohms?

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Is each voice coil 4 ohms? If so, wire the VCs in series on each sub, then run both subs in parallel.

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6497/subsgy3.jpg

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Run the subs off individual channels. Less strain on the amp and less on the subs. It is the best way for sound quality but maybe not maximum power.

Either that or run the subs in parrallel and bridge the amp. Just beware, you will need a 2ohm load in series with the subs and it will be dissipating most of the extra wattage as heat. So you will need a 100W+ ballast resistor. This should go in the -ve speaker cable back to the amp.

There is no ideal way to run your system, anything will be a compromise.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

also if this is in a honda, you had better run a high end battery and a capacitor. or be prepared to replace your battery very often(me).
ever since i put my capacitor in last year its been gold for a year till it took a ---- two weeks ago(battery).

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Don't do this all of the ways you posted will work fine. The amp sees the same load in all cases the only difference is that if you use example one the subs will still be in stereo, IF the amp isn't bridged internally which it may be if it is a dedicated sub, or monoblock amp.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

I usually just upgrade the head unit, then get myself some pioneer speakers for the cabin, then I get a amp and a 12 and throw it in a little box. That goes in the trunk.

Then you gotta make your license place not move so bitches arent like "damm that fools ---- be rattling"..

Typical ni groid froid, high desert setup.


Good for 9's.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

upgrade your Alt to a high output one, and upgrade your Alt to Battery power wire, and chassis ground wire.


a cap is a band aid only.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

sorry bud, but if I wire the subs parallel the whole way, it will be a 1 ohm load. the subs are DUAL 4ohm Voice Coil subs.

the amp is only stable to 4ohm bridged.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Ok then, wire them up like in my pic and you'll be golden.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

lol


the head unit is a Pioneer, the Amp is a Profile AP2000, and the subs are 2 15" Earthquake DBXI-15d

i think i will have a bit more to worry about than a little license plate rattle.

:y

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

yep, that was the plan

thanks jago

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

already did all those, had no choice anyways lol. but i hope you still add a cap, they do help.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

I have a cap in my system, why would you call it a bandaid? It helps reduce load on the alternator.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

read this thread...

specifically posts 2 and 3...

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread/t-49396.html


more info can be provided if needed.


in short, i wont be wasting money on a cap.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Sure if your alternator is underpowered, a cap won't fix that.

A cap is not a bandaid itself, it only helps things. It's when kids think it will solve all their electrical problems when I can understand calling it a bandaid.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

sorry but i still have to disagree.

IMO, caps are bandaids and marketing.

the right way to do it is to get up Alt upgraded and to use extra batteries.


why do you think all of the major competitors in SPL shows use multiple Alts and lots of batteries???

http://www.stevemeadedesigns.com/boa...?showtopic=144

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Because they have more money to spend?

If you think a cap is worthless then you don't understand how it works. At least you stated it's just your opinion.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

i know exactly what its for....


when the bass hits, it drops the batties voltage down, and the Alt recharges it. A cap is used to help reduce the voltage drop caused by the power draw from the amp.

for "short" bursts of bass, a cap may help. but for prolong periods of pounding your system, the cap is nothing more than an extra draw on the alt that it needs to charge.


thus, my reasoning for calling it a band aid.



the "general population" does not need a cap. they need to fix the wiring, upgrade the alt, and upgrade the battery. by doing those things, you shouldnt have a need to get a cap.

if there is still something wrong after upgrading those items, you have at least 1 thing wrong....

to many amps for your electrical system or

to many shitty amps hooked up (ie Pyle, Pyrimid, Crunch, Boss, Legacy, etc...)

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

I cap is not a band aid. It will correct certain problems. If you are listening to music, the bass hits your lights dim slightly, it is because the electrical system is not producing enough current. This will result in a voltage drop. Now if you have a cap, as soon as the voltage drops below the level in the cap, the cap will discharge, providing extra current to the electrical system in the car. Once the bass stops hitting, there is no longer a shortage of current in the system, everything will start getting full voltage from the alternator and charge the battery and cap back up. This is easier on you alternator because it is easier for the alternator to provide a slightly higher current for a slightly longer period of time. As opposed to providing a much higher level of current. I have 3 caps in my truck a couple thousand watts. If you are putting a large amp in a honda get a cap, at least.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

fork....


thanks for rewording exactly what i just said.


and no, its "not" easier on your alt, its just another thing that it has to charge up. and if your adding a cap because, as you said, "the electrical system is not producing enough current", then that is exactly why you need to upgrade other items that i mentioned all ready.

as far as your truck and what you have, that besides the point. you having a "couple thousand watts" doesnt mean to much to me. Ive been doing this for 15 years, seen my fair share of car audio in those years, and I can count on 1 hand, how many "real systems" ive seen and had a cap installed.

we can "discuss" this all you want, but the supporters of a power cap can talk talk till they are blue in the face, because I will still have my opinion and what i have seen.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

If you aren't in competition and just have the lights dim slightly only when huge bass hits then a cap will stabilize the voltage. It's not just another thing the alternator has to charge, you are using the same amount of power regardless. Just when a loud note hits and the amp demands peak power momentarily, the cap will discharge and take care of it and be fully charged before it happens again. Sometimes the car's stock alt/battery just won't handle it though.

Jo what you are talking about is an ideal setup, with extra batteries. That doesn't mean that a cap is a bandaid in all situations, unless you are talking about somebody who really needs to upgrade their charging system when a cap just won't do.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

what make/model amp? If your going for SQ id run each sub on different channels, but if your going for SPL id go with option 2. In a handful of cases, some amps will put out far more power going 1 or 2 ohm bridged even though they say they only do 4 ohm mono or so. Some us amps and earthquake etc amps are like that, in addition to soundstream, orion, earlier mtx and RF amps too, also some old Lanzar amps. In my experience with your average amp, youll get a little greater power at the expense of limiting the lifespan on the amp and possibly putting it into thermal overload quickly. Sometimes, if you just wanna mess around it can get interesting

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

jago...

actually i am not talking about someone with an "ideal" setup.

most factory alts SHOULD be able to handle "moderate" loads from a sound system. If you experience ANY dimming of the lights, then there is something wrong within the charging system. a cap will only band aid the real problem, which is most likely a weak/dying alt.

personally i have never owned a cap, nor plan to. I have always spent the money, which is roughly the same amount for a cap, to have my alt upgraded.

and no, i dont have a honda or import. my stock amps on my alt is 105. i have been driving the same car for 8 years and have been through countless different setups and only 2 alts (stock, and the current replacement that i had upgraded at a local place).

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

thanks for the input. :y

the amp is a Profile AP2000 - i have had very good luck running this model series. for the money, there isnt to much in its class. yes, there are far better amps, but not in this price range. Plus, IMO, Profile is no worse than kicker/pioneer/kenwood/etc.... they are deffinately not a Legacy/Pyramid/Boss/etc... brand.

2-channel car amplifier
320 watts RMS x 2 at 4 ohms (480 watts RMS x 2 at 2 ohms)
960 watts RMS x 1 bridged output at 4 ohms (4-ohm stable in bridged mode)
variable low-pass filters (50-250 Hz, 12 dB/octave)
variable bass boost (0-12 dB) at 45 Hz
variable subsonic filter (20-50 Hz)
wired bass level remote control
stereo or bridged mono output
Tri-way capable (Tri-Way crossover required)
preamp- and speaker-level inputs
preamp outputs
fuse rating: 25A x 4
4-gauge power and ground leads and a 100-amp fuse recommended — wiring and hardware not included with amplifier
24-3/16"W x 2"H x 10-5/16"D

https://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/pr...2000-f_dg.jpeg



the subs that are being used are Earthquake DBXi-15d, 2 of them...

Massive Excursion

Stitched Leads

Spring Loaded Terminals

Cast Aluminum Frame

Double Stacked Magnet with boot

Nomex/Romex Double Spiders

TCT (Turbine Cooled Transducer) Cooling Device

* 1000 Watts RMS 2000 Walls Peak Power
* 15" cast frame subwoofer
* Dual voice coil 4-ohm
* XMax 1.5-Inch, 30.48 mm
* 3" voice coil, aluminum bobin
* Sensitivity 88 dB
* Free Air Resonance 20Hz
* 150 Oz double stacked magnet

http://www.procarsound.es/imagenes/f...666c5ab4d0.jpg

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

FACLAEB

----
A
Cap
Love
An
Extra
Batt

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

Just to apologise for being a dumbass didn't realise it was dual voice coils. Never come across that before. What Jago suggested should be just fine. Voice coils in series, subs in parallel, into the amp in bridged mode. Though you would get similar power output from running the voice coils in parallel and running one sub from each channel. Running 2 ohm loads is pretty bad for thermal loading on amps. And if that is a class D amplifier, lower impedance loads will create significantly higher distortion. But most SPL cars sound like ---- anyway.

A good AMP should really have reservoir caps internally to cope with moments of peak power output. But a large reservoir cap is a good way of coping with uneven power demands. Where it won't help if your average power draw is greater than that of the alternators output. All of the caps i've seen that are sold for audio are way overpriced. And you could easily buy the same number of Farads from digikey for not much.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

wow so you have been doing this for 15 years, and"bumping since I was 16" and you don't know how to wire subs to your profile amp.

Re: car audio EXPERTS please help....
 

fork, dont even try to flame dude, it wont work.

first of all, i asked which was the better way and provided the ways i could wire it up.

the question was not how to, but which way is better/more efficiant for the amp.

any ------- retard can hook up a system, i wanted info on why one way was better than the other way. read my first post again.


and yes, i have been bumping for 15 years, that doesnt make me an "expert" just like your 2000 watt system doesnt make you an expert either.