The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

So after my failed turbo install this last winter...Ive gotten ticked off enough to go ahead and build anouther set up from the ground up. Ive got 2 spare F22 blocks (one pretty complete, one just odds and ends) and I plan on spending the next year building one up.

The Goals:
About 300hp @ the wheels @ daily driven mode
350-400 on Race gas for the track
Using this turbo:
http://www.blaastperformance.com/maps/t04e60-map.jpg

The more I learn about the F22 block the more I like it, but I need someone more knowledgable to point me to the right direction. (BiggDaddy feel free to chime in on this)

The enigne will be built with forged internals, not sure what brand those will be yet, w/ stock sleeves. Im thinking maybe send out my second block after the build for some sleeves in the future, but I want to get a nice setup running before that extreme.
What Im not sure on is what head to use? I cant make up my mind between staying with a milled out F22a6 head or using an H22 head....or maybe even just an H23 head.

So what is the right path here? Have I even selected the right turbo?

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

Get rid of the balance shafts too. I`m building an f22/h22a combo for a 91 civic.

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

Eliminating the balance shafts is something Ive thought of....Im thinking I may not though, unless it makes a big deal. My thinking is that honda put them there for a reason, probably to increase the life span of the motor.

Am I wrong on this?

Are you building for a boost setup?

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

I believe it's done by the car manufacturers to cut down on some of the vibrations made by the engine(creature comforts??)...Eliminating them cuts down on the number of moving parts(inertial mass??) inside the engine(fewer things that can break) and allows the engine to rev faster and more responsively...At least that is what the 4G63 and QR25 crowd preach...I plan on eliminating mine in the future, it's a relatively cheap mod...

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

Yeah yeah I get all that.... but my mode of thinking is at high power levels less vibrations are a good thing, and would keep the crank in place. I can see the logic behind pulling out all the rotating mass on a purpose built drag engine that is going to be rebuilt in a month our two, but I just dont like the idea of doing it on an engine I intend on getting me to a track 3 hours drive away.

Dont all the 4G63 drivers bitch about crank walk anyway? I wonder how many have crank walked w/ balance shafts vs. w/o?

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

Just for the record guys. Is there a mount kit that will fit an F22 in to an EG? I have never done the research on this but it would seem like a sweet engine swap if only the mounting part was figured out.

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

H23/h22/f23/f22 and all those crazy variations of the F series engine (minus f20c duh) all have the same engine mounts, or atleast those first four do. So if you buy an H22 mount kid you can mount an F22 into the car no problem. :)

You doing a head swap at all? You should do a built F22 block with H22 head. ;)

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

Been thinking of that as well, but whats the point at boost? Does an H22 head really flow that much better then a ported f22 head? Ever since people figured out that F blocks use similar casts as H blocks the price of H heads has been skyrocketing....300$ for a complete head...wouldnt a ported F22a6 head flow better ? Is it worth it I wonder?

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

4G63's with the 7BOLT flywheel are known for crankwalkin', and that is due to mitsubishi stuffin' those engines with a mismachined crank, I don't believe that eliminated balance shafts have anything to do with it...The more moving parts you have in ANY piece of machinery adds to the complexity of that machinery, and IMO the more complex something is the more chances there are of something f@ckin' up...

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

I'm actually running my boosted f22 at 12-13ish psi On an Evo 8 turbo. according to joey davis its's capable of making 400 hp the turbo that is.

My block is a practically brand new unused f22b1 and my head is an f22a1. I'm telling you guys this car is a ------- beast. My butt dyno says something close to 300hp but it's probably not. I actually have a good paying steady job now so I'll be hitting a dyno soon...and I'll probably get some forged rods and pistons in the next month or two and daily drive it on about 20psi.
When I was in Indiana with JD at the king of the strip thing he was telling me you only get about 10k out of a built and sleeved block. Is that true with all forged pistons or is it just with forged pistons and sleeves?

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

I see. Thanks for the info Sinister. I might just consider this when I blow the Built B16 up :6

For now I need to keep her together and reliable because I might be moving to the east coast for Naval training within the next few months so no big projects for me till I'm done my schooling.

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

I'm highly cosidering picking up an F22 block off a friend of mine to start building... but I think my next boost project after the z6 will be an LS :) but then again an F22 would be cool too... hmm

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

I want to know this too...maybe I should just say ---- that sleeved block plan

My first turbo attempt was with a 16g as well that never ran right...turbo issues. I never did believe that little thing could get me past 250hp

Re: The F22a1 Build...what to do??
 

PM ME and ill git you my number... we can chat.

I think youre on the right path. You are in exactly the situation I was In when I started along the path I went... A FIRM proponent of the F series; being of the opinion its THE most underestmated Honda Platfoim- well its definately gaining acceptance now- I know my old setup made some believers

I started by blowing my original f22b1 block (all stock) after 25000 miles of constant abuse(175K total). I was originally just going to do a bored bock and run a H22 Crank Rods and custom pistons (pistons with the pins raised to compensate for the h rods...) with a Kaizenspeed balance shaft eliminatror kit... Elimnating the Balance shafts WILL ake a noticeable difference, my ---- was all balanced, and I could tell... Hasport mounts (not to mention the SOLID front torque mount i have) make it noticable, but its not so bad to where its unbearable. Mine seems to have the most vibration between 2500 and 3K.... Youl get around 10HP and 10 pounds off the motor by removing them. I have the Kaizenspeed kit that comes whith all the ---- you need to do it. For how slick it is, its worth the 125 bux. Also, a noticable difference in throttle responce....

I wanted just to put athe SOHC VTEC head back on it but Josh wasnt having it... He wanted me to do the A-6 head or.. Go H22 head on the block.... I built my head while planning to do the g22 thing.... The H22 Head flows 290ish cfm stock if im not on crack.... so it moves some air... I Said fuckit, if im going that far Im gonna build A complete H (Sleeved of coarse). Seing as i needed something to throw money into... It was doable...


Sooo.... Id really like to see what you could get out of a similar G setup I was talking about.... (H22 Head on the F block with Rods\Pistons etc..... If you went that route id maybe go a bit bigger on the snail even... My motor has no problem with the T4 PT6176.. In fact spools it pretty brutally... Ive got like 19 psi by 5k.... In fact it shouold all be back together in 3-4 weeks.

Let me know if you got anything you think i may be able to help with...


Oh ya by the way... A ported Ax F head with some porting and a cam WILL flow great... Look to BISI for info... Not to Jock ride, but that man knowws more about the F thean anyone Ive run across... Ive talked to himn a couple times in person, and an the phone as well... He is VERY helpful.. If you can catch him on the phone. I think its bisimoto.com. Anyways, out of the Box the H22 head flows really well, so i figured id save the cash from portimng/cam etc. to build the head (and still have a mild port done)......

A complete JDM h22 head can be had for 300 bux. If your car is OBD1 - look for an JDM dizzy too... Itll make the wiring harness cake.