call me crazy, turbo'd cutlass!!
 

hey guys, i've been looking around the forums here and decided to register to see what you all thought of my crazy idea. now, i'm expecting some of you to not like it, but please, don't be too much of a prick, i'm just having some fun with the first car;D anyways, on to the story...i have a 1996 olds cutlass which i got for $500. it had blown head gaskets, and the body was in perfect condition, amazing since it lived in northern michigan all its life. i have a garrett t3 off an old lebaron for a turbo, bearings and everything are PERFECT. (junkyard turbo, got it for a buck), and an intercooler from a supra for $20. unfortunately, the inlet and outlet are on the same side, but it's huge, so i guess i'll suffice. if anyone is familiar with this car, i would like some input on where to actually mount the turbo, since it's slightly harder to do on a 3.1 V6 than a 4 banger. i have the intercooler mounted already, so i don't have to store it somewhere lol. another thing, i would like to use those digital A/F gauges carried at advance and autozone, but will they work on narrow band O2s? one of my buddies said it would only work at full throttle? any edumacation on this guys? ok, well i guess i'll keep this somewhat short. if anyone wants some pics, let me know, i can get some, but the turbo is back home, so i won't have pics of it till after turkey day. well, roast away...

read read read and read you are no where near on the right path. to be honest you are about a years worth or reading away from where you need to be

Over the transmission like everyone else with a FWD.

agree'd, but the 3.1 or 3.4 can actually be turbo'd really well. you might also want to take a look at thirdgen.org or some fiero forums. dunno for sure if it would fit a cutlass, but a setup from a fiero would prolly fit fwd too? dunno what you can do about fuel control though. as already stated, lots of info out there, you better spend some days reading up.

the o2 gauge you talk about seems to be a narrowband, meaning it will be all over the place during closed loop operation, but once you mash it the ECU will go to open loop and stop cycling the o2 sensor and that's the only time you will see a steady signal on the gauge. for a good tune you would want a wideband o2 though. good luck

the only problem i can see with mounting it over the tranny is the heat. i don't want the heat from the turbo cooking my battery and everything else. so far i'm thinking either in the empty space in the front bumper(damn plastic ----), or right next to the rack and pinion under the car. i won't know for sure what i'm going to do until i actually get all the stuff and start building. my MAP and MAF (yeah, this piece has both) are going to be fooled through "creative modification", as i like to call it. i have a cold start injector off an old BMW that i'll use for extra fuel. as far as A/F, i talked to my fuels instructor at lincoln today, and he reaffirmed my concerns about the gauge, so i'll end up using the one that my buddy at school told me about. oh, and if anyone is curious, it's a 44mm T3 turbo

my first f-body was a 3.1 v6. iirc the MAP is only used for BARO corrections? so your cutlass is a MAF system right?
btw imho the turbo from the le baron should be a 50trim.. was it a T1 or T2?

huh

if that was in response to my question about T1 or T2.. i know the turbo is a Garrett T3 ;) but the turbododge k-engines are called Turbo I ("T1"), Turbo II ("T2") etc.

The turbo is a .48 AR garret of of a old lebaron I am a k car fan and also helping with this build, I think the owner of the baron had the garret put on in place of the junk ass mistu turbo that should have been on that car. The garrets should have only been on the older style of the T1 with the nasty log mani. I think the turbo should fit the needs of this build well, He isn't hoping for for a 7 sec car here just something to help the 2 ton tank get down the road. We are planing on using the extra injector/hobbs switch style of fuel management (ya we got some true ---- going on) and if we had found a T2 in the yard I would have stolen the parts and put them on my cars!

dont you think a .48 a/r turbo is going to be alittle very small for a 3.1L? have either of you ever sucessfully turbo charged a n/a car before?

hey plymouth, turbo k-car ftw! :cool: been there done that! i did the same when my mitsu turbo went south on my 92 2.5 Turbo-I Tona, just swapped in a freshly rebuilt Garrett on there, but mine is off an '89 Turbo-II so no log-style ;) the older Turbo-I's had a strange compressor flange i remember? Chris from Turbos Unleashed sells some adapters for these btw, maybe you can use one. what k-cars are currently sitting in your yard? or do you have any on the road as well? :D

anyways, depending on goals, the .48 AR T3 will be fine, and depending on head/manifold work and exhaust, you'll get pretty good spoolup and a nice low-end for sure :)

That was the goal to make the turbo spool before you think about getting on it, and he wants to run 7psi and if it holds that turn it to 10psi. He wanted to have good low end and little lag so i thought it would be a good turbo for it.

I have a 2.2 t1 plymouth sundance back home(i go to school in indy so that cars living in my mothers barn till i am out). Then my everyday car that is a TBI 2.5 plymouh sundance RS that might get a t1 swapped in it soon. Lastly i have a 1982 plymouth scamp/dodge rampage I think its a pre-production scamp because mopar does not have the vin in the production list of rampages and it has no production number. So it is a really cool car but that motor is fucked BADLY and i just got it.
I love the old P-bodies.

yeah and absolutley no top end it will just be pushing hot air and hot air creates detonation

It only revs to 5.5k and we got a bad ass intercooler and we will be looking at things closely making sure nothing breaks we will be fine thanks.

well then i wish you the best of luck i wanna see pics start a build thread

+1, an intercooler should help, also at 7psi or 10psi the turbo shouldn't be heating up intake air that much! btw i've seen quite a few build with the 3.1 V6 and variants enduring some big boost #'s, but as always you need a good tune ;)

this IS my first turbo build, but i've educated myself enough to where i'm confident enough to not ---- things up. i don't want to use a bigger turbo because this is my daily driver, and i don't want to put too much boost to blow the engine...YET... after i get another vehicle, i do plan on upping the boost a little to see what i can get out of it. i already have a killer sound system in the car, i think a turbo would be fun too:)

---------pic update--------

i should be able to get some pics of the turbo and intercooler this weekend, plus a few underhood pics and what not

sounds good enough to me. as said you might want to look into some turbo v6 builds on fiero or f-body sites to get some more specific ideas and you could prolly use the same parts in some cases.

when i was in school one of my room mates class mates had a fiero 3.1 hmt turbo kit and was pushing 4 or 5 psi and kept up with his stock f22 8 psi to4e accord. but he eventually put corssica 2.8 pistons in it dropping compression to 7.5 and using hal tek. before i moved it was'nt running though but there is parts out there. i can't remember who but some one makes cams for the 3.1. if its the same as the beretta 3.1 here is an idea.

YouTube - 3.1 chevy beretta creation

good luck.

maybe this link helps? :) ARI Performance

good link^.

you shouldn't have to trick the map sensor. It only reads to one bar, so the computer won't be able to tell if its in boost. The maf on gm cars output a 5v squarewave instead of a voltage signal. There should be enough extra range in the sensor that you'll maxout the stock fuel pump before you max the sensor.

So it shouldn't need tricking, but if the maf does max the pcm throws a P0103(maf freq out of range hi), this will reduce the injector pulse width and make you go very lean. If you hit that, you need an maf interceptor, or fix it in the pcm.

haha, update again. i got a line on a bunch of free stuff, including blow off valve, engine and transmission tuning chips, oil pump, various other stuff. i now have the turbo down here with me, so all i need to do now is find time to take the pictures. well, i just got off work, so i'm heading to bed

The turbo should be large enough. The 1990 factory 3.1 turbo (pontiac grand prix ste) used a garret t-25 with front mount IC.
It was only rated at 205hp, 225tq, but was almost 1 point lower conpression and based on older version of engine.
N/A of same year as turbo was rated 140hp, 1996 was rated 160hp.

That turbo was pretty much maxxed out at the 205hp it was making.

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i uploaded some pictures of the turbo and the intercooler. enjoy!!

When I said it should be big enough I didn't mean it would be a efficent fit, just usable.
It would be near maxed out also. there would only be about 20-30 more hp on the 96 motor then the the1990 had. The t-3 should flow enough more then the t25 for extra 20-30hp.
T-3 maps vary enough though that it may not or may flow more. If the specs on plate of turbo was posted could pull up compressor chart to see for sure.