Stupid Doubt about FMUs
03-12-2006, 09:58 PM
#21
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
Originally Posted by Bruce
To: <fangle@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [fangle] More 6 coil DIS
From: "Bruce Plecan" <bplecan@woh.rr.com>
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13
2:21 -0500
From:
http://www.t6p.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11341
The latest posting:
Well.....
Here are the first datalogging results from the 6 coil DIS.
These are the corrections that some analysis software I have, has generated.
Across the top are the MAP values, and along the L/H edge, RPM.
A *0* entry means that not enough data was found to average out a final
correction. The corrections are based on a max value of 255, a min of 0, and
a *no correction needed value of 128*. The *target* AFR is 14.7:1. So a
correction of 125 means fuel was removed, to maintain a 14.7:1, and a 130
would mean fuel had to be added.
This data was collected at 55-75 MPH, basically just in cruise/ light load
conditions. There was some low speed *running* before getting to freeway
speed, as evidenced by the 1,000 RPM entries.
So what does it mean?,
It means that at the lower load areas, the engine could be leaned down, to
maintain the 14.7:1 AFR, ie the *burn* is more complete.
In the higher load areas, there is a demand for more fuel... Meaning that
while under load, the better *burn*, can use more fuel in order to maintain
the same AFR.
****
Now for some really interesting stuff.
What few people look at is that while a Turbo can make boost, it can also
assist the engine in breathing while still in less then boost conditions.
Pre 6 coil, I generally cruised with a max MAP of 65 K/Pa. In this log you
can see that I was *cruising* with K/Pas ranging up to 95!. What this means
is the turbo had enough exhaust flow, to start to spool it up at a MUCH
lower load condition. ie better spooling..... And, this is with a TA-62 on a
85 long block, stock heads, 87 intake, Poston Headers, Cotton's F/M, 206/206
cammed *mule engine*. This is a really mild of engine combo..
--- Corrections ---
0,20,25,30,35, 40, 45, 50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100,
400,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
600,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
800,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1000,0,0,0,0,123, 124, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1200,0,0,0,0,125, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 125, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1600,0,0,0,0,128, 130, 130, 129, 129, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 128, 0,
1800,0,0,0,0, 0, 125, 127, 126, 126, 128, 125, 123, 124, 0, 0, 0, 0,
2000,0,0,0,0, 0, 130, 127, 126, 127, 130, 126, 126, 129, 128, 131, 131, 0,
2200,0,0,0,0,128, 127, 123, 125, 125, 126, 125, 125, 124, 126, 129, 130, 0,
2400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
2800,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
3200,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
3600,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4000,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4800,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
Oh, and stay tuned, I did some WOT logging. The results there are also
interesting, I just have to figure out how to post the results in an easy to
understand way.....
Bruce
Subject: [fangle] More 6 coil DIS
From: "Bruce Plecan" <bplecan@woh.rr.com>
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2006 13
2:21 -0500From:
http://www.t6p.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11341
The latest posting:
Well.....
Here are the first datalogging results from the 6 coil DIS.
These are the corrections that some analysis software I have, has generated.
Across the top are the MAP values, and along the L/H edge, RPM.
A *0* entry means that not enough data was found to average out a final
correction. The corrections are based on a max value of 255, a min of 0, and
a *no correction needed value of 128*. The *target* AFR is 14.7:1. So a
correction of 125 means fuel was removed, to maintain a 14.7:1, and a 130
would mean fuel had to be added.
This data was collected at 55-75 MPH, basically just in cruise/ light load
conditions. There was some low speed *running* before getting to freeway
speed, as evidenced by the 1,000 RPM entries.
So what does it mean?,
It means that at the lower load areas, the engine could be leaned down, to
maintain the 14.7:1 AFR, ie the *burn* is more complete.
In the higher load areas, there is a demand for more fuel... Meaning that
while under load, the better *burn*, can use more fuel in order to maintain
the same AFR.
****
Now for some really interesting stuff.
What few people look at is that while a Turbo can make boost, it can also
assist the engine in breathing while still in less then boost conditions.
Pre 6 coil, I generally cruised with a max MAP of 65 K/Pa. In this log you
can see that I was *cruising* with K/Pas ranging up to 95!. What this means
is the turbo had enough exhaust flow, to start to spool it up at a MUCH
lower load condition. ie better spooling..... And, this is with a TA-62 on a
85 long block, stock heads, 87 intake, Poston Headers, Cotton's F/M, 206/206
cammed *mule engine*. This is a really mild of engine combo..
--- Corrections ---
0,20,25,30,35, 40, 45, 50, 55, 60, 65, 70, 75, 80, 85, 90, 95, 100,
400,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
600,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
800,0,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1000,0,0,0,0,123, 124, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1200,0,0,0,0,125, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 125, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
1600,0,0,0,0,128, 130, 130, 129, 129, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 128, 0,
1800,0,0,0,0, 0, 125, 127, 126, 126, 128, 125, 123, 124, 0, 0, 0, 0,
2000,0,0,0,0, 0, 130, 127, 126, 127, 130, 126, 126, 129, 128, 131, 131, 0,
2200,0,0,0,0,128, 127, 123, 125, 125, 126, 125, 125, 124, 126, 129, 130, 0,
2400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
2800,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
3200,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
3600,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4000,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4400,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
4800,0,0,0,0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0,
Oh, and stay tuned, I did some WOT logging. The results there are also
interesting, I just have to figure out how to post the results in an easy to
understand way.....
Bruce
03-13-2006, 02:43 AM
#22
1.0 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 375
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
This is something along the lines of what we achived.
http://www.rddreams.com/rddreams/htm...wtopic&t=10165
But basiclly he should just hook up a gas analyser and post the results it will be a lot easier to understand.
The funny thing we noticed is the more gas you keep feeding the engine the more the power keeps going up. Which is kinda hard to explain.
The Smuit unit @ close to 120$ is outside my budget. It sure looks like the right pice of kit. Guess Ill keep alook out on ebay. Or try making another unit. Or just try with a better fuel pump.
http://www.rddreams.com/rddreams/htm...wtopic&t=10165
But basiclly he should just hook up a gas analyser and post the results it will be a lot easier to understand.
The funny thing we noticed is the more gas you keep feeding the engine the more the power keeps going up. Which is kinda hard to explain.
The Smuit unit @ close to 120$ is outside my budget. It sure looks like the right pice of kit. Guess Ill keep alook out on ebay. Or try making another unit. Or just try with a better fuel pump.
03-15-2006, 10:47 PM
#24
1.0 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 375
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
So you read my post on plug mods ?Dam I hate this country spent 20 minutes typing up reponce and the power went.
On the Plugs. Hate them fancy stuff. Hate the 4 wire gimick plugs. Hate em gold and platinum plugs only cause Im allways broke lol
Good ole NGK or regular plugs in the right heat range.
Bend the earth strap back.
Sharpen the earth strap to a point. Sharpen the electrode to a point.
Then dull the point a Bit. We dont want it becoming red hot glowing seting off deto.
Re-gap the plug works well.
WOnt last 100,000 Kms but will last at least 20,000 Kms.
The guy above may not get the same results we are geting.
We get the results cause we take out the regular 250 Volt .5MFD cap.
We then put in a 400 or 600 volt Cap with a 2 MFD cap.
Each cap is charged twice but discharged only once.
Cars is a diffirent ball game.
The only way out here is to get a Ferite core going. THen get the IGBTs and SCRs as used by the TIG welding guys.
Pump out 600 - 800 volts from the ferite control the spark with a pic and your ready to rock and roll.
03-16-2006, 12:55 AM
#25
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
Originally Posted by chinoy
So you read my post on plug mods ?
I cut back the ground strap on NGK BRK7E-11 and the NGK R5671-A8/-A9's sometimes to help quench, that's about it.
Originally Posted by chinoy
On the Plugs. Hate them fancy stuff. Hate the 4 wire gimick plugs. Hate em gold and platinum plugs only cause Im allways broke lol
I generally don't like creating a sharp-ish point on anything in a combustion chamber, and with a conventional coil system you don't want a point that aids arc-over. The power you are pushing... do you have problems with un-pointed plugs misfiring? I can envision arc-over wandering all over the place, like with lightning, and am unsure if you'd run wierd because of it.
03-16-2006, 09:09 AM
#27
1.0 BAR
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 375
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
Originally Posted by baldur
Yeah, all the idiots buy overpriced iridium spark plugs, that look more like glow plugs to me with the needle thin electrode.
Endless iscusions phew.
No man no point more like a rounded edge.
If you must do something do that. WIll probally land up looking like your mod.
No I dont have any misfire issues. With or without the plug mod.
Ok geting back on topic.
Drag Nationals are 4 weeks away. 99% of the competition in my class is runing nos so beating them shouldnt be hard if I can sort out my FMU. Im running in the Forced Induction class upto 1400cc. My cars weight is 865 Kgs or lets say 965 Kgs with me in it lol.
The fastest time with NOS is like 15+ seconds.
Now dont laughf you arent runing our **** poor gas. Or **** poor engines. Fact is in a country of 1 Billion People thats the fastest.
Runing anything under 14 should garuntee a national record.
Took the car out to a decent road today to figure out whats going on.
Im runing rich as per the O2 readings that for sure. Not a problem will lean out when the WB comes in.
But the problem is with when you floor the accelrator. THe bowl in the carb goes empty in 2 seconds. Then boost falls and it goes into a viscious circle till it stalls.
Where as if I accelrate slowlly. Basiclly give the boost enoughf time to hit the FMU. It increases flow and the flow keeps up with the boost. And she accelrates cleanlly not runing out of gas. all the way to the redline hits the PSI seting set WG opens and she keeps runing fine.
There is a term for this i.e. geting the FMU to start working before the onset of boost.
Hits the FMU.
How does this work. any idea. Maybe I can build a new FMU that does it.
03-16-2006, 11:22 PM
#29
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
MAn I have nowhere near the knowlage or understanding of these things as you guys do.
But I was wondering if going with a larger fueline would help?It could be just draining all the fuel volume for the line before the fmu and pump can catch up?
But I was wondering if going with a larger fueline would help?It could be just draining all the fuel volume for the line before the fmu and pump can catch up?
03-16-2006, 11:59 PM
#30
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Re: Stupid Doubt about FMUs
Is your fuel pump boost referrenced?
I dunno your setup, but with a mechanical fuel pump, driven off the engine, that supplied most carbeureted cars in America, you can drill a hole in the top of the pump and epoxy in a vacuum barb. Run a hose from manifold to fuel pump, and as boost increases, the pressure on the far side of the pump increases so that the fuel pressure doesn't fall off.
I dunno your setup, but with a mechanical fuel pump, driven off the engine, that supplied most carbeureted cars in America, you can drill a hole in the top of the pump and epoxy in a vacuum barb. Run a hose from manifold to fuel pump, and as boost increases, the pressure on the far side of the pump increases so that the fuel pressure doesn't fall off.
