4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

So someone tell me a better place to do some tuning...

It's 3am, and my buddy and i are chillin in the dorms, bored as ----.... and i get the genious idea....

LETS GO TUNIN ON THE HIGHWAY!!!! nO cars out, street lights are on, 4 lane highway (8 lanes total) for our tuning pleasure!!!!

So we grab my laptop, dataloggign cable, chip burner, det cans setup, and head out to Rt. 3 in Nashu, NH. (right next to our college.

So we do quite a few 3rd gear pulls.... My buddy wearing the det cans and hittin the record button on CromePro, and i'm sittin watching fuel, boost, and driving.

Runs way lean the first few pulls... (upper rpms are around 14.8 - 16 !!! And Mike hears some detonation around 4-5k... then it grows more and more and lots of det. between 6-7k.

SO>>>> pull out crome, dataloggin, do some auto adjusts... i think it needs more... i tweak some fuel curves and drop the timing way down... Slowly adding more timing and a little more timing...

Now... I have a real steady a/f of 12.6 in boost, and can't hear much detonation anymore...

Detonation sounds EXACTLY like rice dropping on tinfoil... (who ever came up w/ that analogy first is a genious, becasuse that's exactly it).
HERE'S MY QUESTION.... HOW MANY TIMES CAN YOU HEAR DETONATION SAFELY? Because i advanced the timing a little bit at a time... BUT... i am hearing "one piece of rice drop" just above 6k rpm.

Is just one rice drop ok? I think i'm going to pull it out anyway.

Dizzy's set to 16* btdc.
on the 450 dsm injectors @ 10psi right now....

Soon as ignition is 100%.... I'm puttin the 880cc's in, and goin for 20psi :S O0
Just hope my clutchmasters stage 3 will hold up ::)

HORRAY FOR DET CANS!!!! I'm in love with them, and use them ALL THE DAMN TIME when i'm tryin to find out where a noise is coming from.

Ripper vids coming soon. Stay tuned.
Who needs VTAK?!?! i got TeRbough!!!

~Kevin

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

I must be retarded and slow this morning....what are Det cans? :1

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

I'm guessing some ghetto ass cans used for hearing detonation, I've heard them mentioned before. Would like links to more info because I'm hopefully tuning this weekend.

Not sure, has been in the 70s and 80s and this weekend it's supposed to be freezing temps, goddamnit.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Attachment 28261

Det cans~~!!!!!

I'm just usein em here to locate a noise...

When drivin, u put the end of the hardline hose on the end of a pipe that you bolt to the block.

I used a 6" Brass nipple... crushed the end of it, put a hose barb on the end of it, and feed the hose out the back of the hood, in the window, and listen in the ear muffs.

Works like a CHARM!!!! SO much better at detecting detonation. I LOVE IT.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

nice valve cover!

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

i <3 bondo
HMT style haha

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

i got MOOOVED! i thought i was just tellin a funny story about tunin on the highway~ not discussin engine management.

oops~

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Ur DET setup looks pretty sweet.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

I bought supplies to make my own. Got some muffs, some 3/8" ID tubing, 3/8" ID barb fitting for the ear muff part, some brass 3/8" OD tube to stick in the other end of the tubing (this will be crushed and bolted to the block), and an M6 and M8 bolt in case I needed either. I'll be taking my muffs apart and hooking up only one, it should be easier to use in the car this way. I only got 6 feet of tube, hopefully enough to run from the block through the firewall and to head level.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Run richer than 12.6:1, your lone pingie should go away.

I'm pretty unimpressed by running lean a time or two. ---- happens and it hurts nothing. You run lean enough and frankly there isn't any damage to be done; cylinder pressures drop off quick past 16.5-17:1 AFRs.

What fucks things up is idiots holding into the gas and not letting out - some local asshat was driving his buddie's car while I tuned, we had a boost controller problem where we were trying to go from 6 psi to 8-9 (on a stock MAP) and got 16 instead. You can hear audible detonation, wideband is going lean, I'm smacking the guy's arm and telling him to lift and all he can do is yell "YES! YES!" and hold into it, then grab the next gear just as hard as he can and hold into it some more. :1

What fucks things up is idiots beating on their cars when they don't run correctly. If you get the classic flat spots in powwer, where it feels like the car trailer hitches at WOT, it's because your AFRs are borderline and swinging between rich enough to make power and not rich enough to make power. Go out and beat on the car all night, then blame someone else when it comes apart.

What fucks things up is not making sure your cam and crank are in time after ---- has been decked/milled. Oh, you got the OEM marks lined up the way they should go? That doesn't mean anything. Two degrees off at the cam is a quarter tooth on most Honduhs, manifests as four degrees off at the crankshaft aka ignition timing, things get completely fucked when idiots try to use timing lights with advance features that have nothing to do with setting base timing or try to run D15 crank pulleys on D16 when they have incorrect markings, etc. I see a lot of centered distributors on cars that have no business running centered distributors, the owners swear they checked their timing. They'll show you how 0.030" decked D16 lines up to the 0 degree mark on a D15Z1 pulley with a timing advance light dialled to 16 degrees, and you don't know how to begin to explain to them it's they have no clue what they are doing. :3

What fucks things up is not tuning your timing under boost. You and your LS? You're fine. LS is very indifferent to ignition timing, and you hooked up a set of det-cans and gave things a swing. My favorite example for timing are D16's, the small bore engines have such small piston areas for combustion pressures to push against, and get really volatile. You can tell people all day to get on a dyno and play around with timing and see how power changes, but they pretty much don't. I'd rather street tune a 350-400 whp B-series and let it go than have a 250-275 whp D16 pass through my fingers without a dyno session to make sure it's a happy engine.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Even though I have nothing to contribute to this thread, I'd just like to thank JD for all this info...good stuff to be had from you that usually gets passed over in all the honda bullshit.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Hey JD thanks for your contribution...
But are u hecklin me sayin i'm doin somethin wrong?? ???


"what fucks ---- up" - by Joseph Davis
"what grinds my gears" - by Peter Griffin


But i hear ya... i've blown up a couple D's in the past... they REALLY dont' like detonation.

Driving the car w/ out listening on the det cans, you can't hear anything audible... But w/ the Detcans on, we could hear it.... I got it all pulled out too. Fuel is fixed to about 12.1 to 12.5 average. It's around 12.5 in the lower half of the rpm range, and 12.3 to 12.1 in the upper RPMS.

It is tuned very conservatively right now, but i want this engine to last a long time, so i'm taking my time w/ the tuning, and LEARNING A LOT through all this. I tuned my D engines as well, and my last D ran mint... @ 23psi... Only problem was my sleeves couldn't handle the power, and i got a hairline crack in the sleeve. Next mornin went to start it and it hydro locked.



But JD... that asshat ur talkin about... what the fucks up w/ that?!?! Car is runnin like ----, and he keeps goin??? Whats he got, walnuts for brains?

JD~ U should publish that as a satire off of "what grinds my gears" haha. Good stuff.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

i iowa coupe where you located at goin to the cedar falls raceway on may 5th?!

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

No, I'm not saying anything of the sort. There was a slight undertone to your post that you were looking for affirmation that what you were doing is correct. I posted all that other ---- to let you know what you have to worry about... you don't sound like a ------- idiot, you can obviously look at datalogs and listen to det-cans and make sound common sense judgements, I think you're doing a fine job.

Drop the AFRs to a flat 12:1 under boost is all I recommend. Single digit boost and 12.5 or under is fine, but you aren't making any more power running it as 12.5:1 than you would at a flat 12, and there is a big jump in engine cooling at 12:1.

Re: 4am... highway 3.... Det cans.... Built LS-t
 

Sounds good. And ya, u judged my tone well. haha.

On a lighter note... I found the perfect sound that u can hear in the det cans... I went to the late night grill here on campus... and mike and i (he helped me w/ it when i told him what to do) got some grinders an they were wrapped in tin foil. Here in NH... it was sleeting out. We walked outside, and we both just looked at each other to the sound of the sleet on the sandwiches and just started laughing. ;D

And thnx for the compliment that i'm not an idiot lol. I posted my new ignition maps and such in my other thread here in engine management if ur curious. Total timing @ 10psi at redline (7500rpm) was 18.25*