EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
01-15-2009, 04:36 AM
#63
1.5 BAR
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 828
Re: EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
Originally Posted by Joseph Davis
Have you not read this thread? 
However, since this thread is about watching Gaza in real time i wasn't sure if anyone knew what was actually happening there, like how the Israelis are using white phosphorus on civilian neigborhoods and how 1/3 of the casualties are children (and there are dozens of reports of them being shot at close range by the IDF), and then the next thread will be about some Arab terrorist that flew some planes into a building or blew himself up in the middle of a crowded street and everyone wonders how someone could do such a thing.
But yea, noone cares so I'll see if i can find more pics.
01-15-2009, 06:46 AM
#64
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Re: EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
People have been killing each other over that shitty piece of desert for a couple thousand years now. Over what? ------- stupidity is what. Just because one faction currently has the upper hand you expect me or anyone on this forum to be swayed into taking sides? Excuse me, I am educated and know from history that the only time wars are won are when the civilians are wholesale massacred and the country's infrastructure gutted. Sounds like Israel is doing a GOOD JOB.
If I saw my family and loved ones getting wholesale slaughtered by a decisively better armed force for, oh, fifty ------- years I wouldn't be determined to stay. I'd call up the Israeli government and tell them I know that one of those rockets they killed my dear sweet auntie had to have cost a fuckload more than four plane tickets to Saudi Arabia, so hook it the ---- up and help expedite some visas because me and the remainder of my family want the ---- out of the war zone. But, no, they can't unplug and have to get right in the middle and play dangerous games. Sounds like buk vs the car thieves to me, down to the flawed Arab reasoning that any five year old can tell is completely fucked.
If I saw my family and loved ones getting wholesale slaughtered by a decisively better armed force for, oh, fifty ------- years I wouldn't be determined to stay. I'd call up the Israeli government and tell them I know that one of those rockets they killed my dear sweet auntie had to have cost a fuckload more than four plane tickets to Saudi Arabia, so hook it the ---- up and help expedite some visas because me and the remainder of my family want the ---- out of the war zone. But, no, they can't unplug and have to get right in the middle and play dangerous games. Sounds like buk vs the car thieves to me, down to the flawed Arab reasoning that any five year old can tell is completely fucked.
01-15-2009, 09:05 PM
#66
1.5 BAR
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 828
Re: EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
lol, I think your misinterpreting my position that i am somehow supporting Hamas, both sides are responsible for bullshit, the problem I have is that everyone takes the side of Israel regardless of anything, our governemt won;t even talk to hamas directly, my entire point is that the United States should reexamine why it supports Israel, if they want to fight a never ending war then thats fine, but why should you and I pay for it?
Anyway, I respect you enough to not continue on with this discussion so lets just agree to disagree and I will avoid this subject in the future.
Anyway, I respect you enough to not continue on with this discussion so lets just agree to disagree and I will avoid this subject in the future.
01-15-2009, 10:34 PM
#67
0.0 BAR
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Re: EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
Originally Posted by signorelli21
Anyway, I respect you enough to not continue on with this discussion so lets just agree to disagree and I will avoid this subject in the future.
01-18-2009, 02:28 AM
#70
1.5 BAR
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 828
Re: EPIC THREAD.. LIVE GAZA CAM
Alright then, let us continue…
First of all you said wars are only won when civilians are wholesale massacred and the country’s infrastructure gutted, and in that regard Israel is doing a good job.
Well by your own account then that’s not true because this conflict has been going on for quite some time, by your reasoning it should have ended long ago with the population of Gaza running away in fear of the mighty Israel, which brings us to another interesting problem of where would they go if they COULD run away?
Anyway the main argument here is that Israel should have the right to defend itself from rocket attacks and therefore any actions it takes to prevent rockets from landing in its cities should be accepted, because of the massive casualties and damage to its infrastructure its retaliation is necessary for the state of Israel to survive. Correct?
No its not...from 2004 to the end of 2007 11 Israeli’s were killed by Qassam rockets while during this time Hamas had fired over 4000 rockets into Israel, but the reason for the low casualties is due to the availability of public bomb shelters and the fact that most of the rockets land in empty fields. Obviously this violates the fourth Geneva Convention (intentionally targeting civilians) and cannot be justified no matter the circumstances.
However lets not conclude that Israel is somehow an innocent victim that is under constant barrage regardless of their actions, lets take a look at some of the things they have done to the Palestinians that might make them want to fire those rockets…
http://www.btselem.org/english/Gaza_...ostilities.asp
Israel completed the disengagement in September 2005. From then until the end of July 2006, soldiers have killed fourteen unarmed Palestinians near the perimeter fence. Five of the fatalities were minors, one of them an eight-year-old girl. Eight of the dead did not even try to reach the fence, and were shot at a distance of from 100 to 800 meters from the fence. Four other civilians were shot when they tried to cross the fence and sneak into Israel to work, and two were shot near the Israeli border. The IDF's announcement confirms that none of the persons killed were carrying weapons or objects with which they could mount an attack. B'Tselem's research also indicates that Israel 's security forces did not warn the Palestinians to go away from the area, and they were not given the opportunity to hand themselves over to the soldiers. The IDF Spokesperson's Office only announced that the soldiers opened fire when they suspected that Palestinians intended to fire at them or sought to place explosives near the fence.
Since June 2007, no raw materials have entered Gaza, forcing 90 percent of the enterprises to cease operations. The construction sector, too, is totally paralyzed. 3,500 businesses have closed down and over 75,000 workers, who support half a million dependants, have lost their jobs.
As a result of the siege, the stocks of imported food products in Gaza are dwindling, driving their prices sky-high, while fruit and vegetables that were intended for export are being sold in Gazan markets at a loss. Many families cannot afford to buy them, however, due to the high poverty rate in Gaza. 80 percent of Gazan households now live below the poverty line, subsisting on less than 2,300 shekels a month for a family of six. Households in deep poverty, living on less than 1,837 shekels a month, currently comprise 66.7 percent of the population. 80 percent of all Gazan families would literally starve without food aid from international agencies.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...=1189411457380
So in conclusion, Israel claims to only want peace, yet their actions indicate otherwise.
Noam Chomsky gave a talk yesterday at MIT on the situation in Gaza, he explains all of this in a lot more detail.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOr9K...-8&sa=N&tab=wv
